T O P
Petering

I loved how the intro and party screen graphic changed based on where you were in the game.


Likes2game03

Oh yes, I loved that. If Arise ever gets a DE, I hope they include an option to switch graphics.


Maxizag123

What is DE?


Likes2game03

Definitive Edition (DE)


Maxizag123

I feel stupid


Few-Address-7604

Welcome to the club.


lumiraya

This was really cool.


LuciensBuddy

That was such a cool touch. And they made all of those screen graphics epic.


themcementality

Saying you get access to 12 artes feels a bit unfair, since you could only have 6 ground artes. Berseria had 16 you could do irrespective of position, and that's not even counting the art chaining you could do by holding the button.


Basileus27

Berseria also had the four Guard shortcuts you unlocked that could interrupt the arte tree at any time (like the B artes in Graces). So you had 20 artes mapped, plus the arte shifts.


Cire101

The character “perks” were in tales games prior so I’d like to see that. Hated the CP system, just another thing to micromanage and it cut into map mechanics which was just annoying. Honestly they should take away more than repeat what they’ve done with arise, I did not enjoy it much lol


Extant_Remote_9931

I hated the CP system. Seemed like a way to funnel you to buying microtansactions since orange gels are so damned EXPENSIVE. To top it off, monsters yeld zero cash. You also need CP to access plot relevant parts on the map. Either CP needs to go or monsters need to give SOME kind of monetary rewards.


rex_915

You can sell monster drops.


Alarming-Opposite-60

the way are supposed to get gald is buy selling items you find in the world and gold and silver are good to sell also.


The_Magus_199

Yeah. I don’t mind it in regular gameplay, since it just provides a decent pacing to go to camps, but it makes every boss fight into a game of “how many permanently limited Orange gels am I willing to waste to try and survive this fight?”


DaemonDesiree

I think if they refined the CP system, it could be cool. I agree that it pushed micro transactions and that orange gels were just too damn expensive for no reason. It was also annoying to have to travel so very far across a map to get to an inn or campsite to refresh or having to go somewhere to sell monster parts. The points that it gets for realism do not outweigh the costs of my time when the character models move so slowly across the map. Just started playing Dragon Quest XI and it’s so freaking nice that the sprint on foot and the gallop on the horse move you so quickly across the map.


themcementality

Yeah I agree, CP only added tedium. If they wanted to keep healing separate from the rest of your abilities, they should have put it on a cooldown or something. That would have at least added some dynamism, rather than popping an orange gel or running back to a campsite.


Likes2game03

Sorry man, I've looked it up and Arise is the only Tales game I've found with the word "perks" associated with it. I will give the CP map action thing tho.


Cire101

Reason I put “perks” in quotations is there’s character unique mechanics in different games. Xillia and Berseria off the top of my head actually.


J_0wn3d

The Earth guy (it’s been awhile since I played arise) has the exact same perk as Leia from Xillia with dodging granting a staff extension.


mischief-maker

Please don't ever bring the CP system back, that shouldn't be a thing ever again


Extant_Remote_9931

The CP system is a cancer that needs never rear it's head again.


mischief-maker

Once I saw that buff spells use CP I was even more sour on the idea.


Alarming-Opposite-60

it is a way to keep you from spaming spells it casts cp and you can gain more cp cure points n the game by defeating enemies, i think it is a good system.


mischief-maker

What's wrong with "spamming" healing spells? It's not like healing has ever been overtly overpowered in this series, in the 2 games before Arise healing magic was completely worthless. I think the closest any game has gotten to overpowered healing is Graces, and even then it's pretty balanced. Plus, it's fun, and that's the last word I'd use to describe CP. Although I'll give you that increasing CP by beating miniboss enemies is a good system, at least.


Tarshaid

There's lots of wrong with spamming healing spells. If one char can spam nurse/revitalise/resurrection, then the char is almost mandatory, hurting team comp. If they can spam strong heals, then spamming strong heals is quickly the strongest thing they can do, and they don't use the rest of their moveset. Thus your team has 3 characters and a mandatory healbot that spams the same heal over and over. And if your team constantly receives strong heals, the only way to get challenge is for the enemy to instakill before the heal spam. That is not fun. For all the good of graces, who speaks of graces saying "yeah I love it when cheria uses her heals, and then uses her heals, and then uses her heals"? Of course there are ways to fix that. The Zestiria/Berseria solution was to nerf healing magic so much it might as well not exist. But you just removed healing altogether, you did not make it right. You could also make healing extremely slow to cast, in which case the mandatory healbot does even less because they're stuck casting. Then you have resource meters, like TP or CP. But CP restricts the resource to heal and buffs and let you use attacks freely.


mischief-maker

But that's kind of how white mages work, it's always been a kind of mandatory class. Besides, in my most recent playthrough of graces, I used Sophie as a healer about as much as cheria, because Heal with some skill buffs and the right gem made it a quick full heal. Plus some games have had item healing characters be a legit replacement for spell healing, notably Repede and Leia.


Tarshaid

White mages have healing spells, sure, I'm not debating it, but they need a reason not to always use their strongest healing spell on repeat just because they can, because there's no comparison between any of cheria's offensive options and "heals 60% of max HP to all allies within a large area". Even if it's not cheria but Sophie, there's no comparison between any of her attacks and "quick full heal". But the rest of their toolkit exists, and should be used, and it's a shame if their entire moveset is obsolete because the best thing they can do, at any moment, is spam their strongest heal. Then the only way, for the enemy, to bypass Sophie using her quick full heal on repeat is an instakill (or to lock her down in such a way it's like she's already KO), and that means overinflating enemy offense beyond what's reasonable. That's still an option, but it's really tuning the entire difficulty and game pace over one character's healing output. I had forgotten chars based on healing items, and that's another option of course, but here the limit is obvious in that you don't just get infinite consumables, even if Leia can turn a simple life bottle into an omega elixir, you still run out of life bottles.


mischief-maker

I don't think I've ever had Cheria on "heal only" duty, she was casting plenty of offensive magic as well. And lemme tell you, Indignation takes forever to cast, but she got that mastery title pretty quick. I do think Graces has a good balance, even on the higher difficulties, of "damage taken" to "heal casting" ratio. I think the only game I've played where the white mage is healing EXCLUSIVELY was my playthrough of Destiny DC. But that's because healing works really stupidly there; it has like, a Smash Bros-like stale moves mechanic, and everything hits abnormally hard even on normal mode. Also it's true that consumables don't last forever, but Repede and Leia's endgame item skills can make items last forever. I know this is anecdotal and totally luck based, but I did have Leia use the same Omega Elixer 5 times in a row during the final boss.


FashionMage

Nonsense. Vesperia's Estelle is exactly what you're describing yet several of the other characters could still fulfill the role of healer to the extent that she wasn't mandatory. On top of that both Estelle and Cheria had strong offensive magic that was absolutely worth using as well. Also healing was low-key worthless in Graces because it was so easy to be one-shot in it, the opposite is true for revives of course. No offense but it says a lot about how much you know of the games that actually have real healers in them without some clown mechanics ruining or outright removing the healer concept ala Zestiria/Berseria/etc.


Tarshaid

Yeah super, replace estelle spamming revitalise with raven spamming love shot, the point still stands (assuming he even keeps up the pace), and in fact vesperia stops you from spamming all day long because TP exists for a reason, and it's basically more restrictive than CP.


mcpe_game123

I think cp could be reworked so that healing consumes all cp and went into recharge, similar to how Kingdom Hearts 2 give you burst heals but consumes all of your mp This is the only idea I think that could save the cp system. Even if it doesn't return im ok with that


mischief-maker

I do love KH2, so I'd be interested in something like that.


SufferingClash

It's problem is that it's shared. If every healer had their own CP pool, it likely wouldn't be as bad.


mischief-maker

True, but then it's basically just TP again.


SufferingClash

The problem with CP as of now is that because it's a shared pool and because buffs use it, you've basically punished players for properly buffing. Which then leads to people not using it because you need the points for healing artes. Which then results in you not using certain characters together because it'll burn through your CP. Unless adjusted to be on a per character basis, it will be a horrible idea for future games. And with per character, you can adjust it. A character who is mostly an attacker with a single self buff would have a massively lower CP pool than a full blown healer.


mischief-maker

It doesn't help that buffs are as incidental as they ever have been. I think Xillia did it... pretty well, because Sharpness and Barrier cast almost instantly, and it can be given to 2 party members at once, but it wears off after a minute or so, and the effect is pretty small. Arise keeps the borderline-unnoticable effect like the rest of the series, but it pulls from your very valuable resource. If the buffs worked like Raine's S-type buffs from Symphonia, where it only went away on getting KO'd, then we'd have an interesting thing going.


SufferingClash

Yeah, permanent buff timers until KO'd would have worked well here, and have made perfect sense why they use CP. Those buffs are lasting for quite a while, so it's one hell of an investment worthy of CP use.


Rob_And_Co

Agreed. To me the CP system felt like a very cheap and contrived way of balancing the difficulty of the game (which is already very easy). That and the HP sponges. Terrible idea all around, it was something they tried, and I hope they never do it again.


ReaperOfProphecy

Agreed. The CP system was absolutely awful. I can't believe there are people that enjoy it. You have healing tied to CP which can only be restored by Orange Gels. Orange Gels can be purchased for 3000 per. To stock up on orange gels, you need to spend 45K on 15 IN addition to purchasing other stuff like equipment and other items. It felt like the developers artificially made the game harder and tried to incentivize the player to make in game purchases. It's so blatantly obvious that I very much hate a lot of the things that Namco bandai did with the game.


MichaelCappelli

The only reason why I liked it, was because I hated having to stop the game so much to restore multiple allies TP because they were healing. This puts all the healing into 1 meter so you have just 1 meter to focus on. I kinda wish they would have a group mana pool in the next game so you just have to use 1 orange gel to heal up 1 TP bar rather than 4.


mischief-maker

If I look at it from the perspective of resource management through long stretches of game play and big dungeons, then it's shit, but KIND Of interesting. Zestiria did something similar to that. But you can so easily run past every single encounter, and just as easily run away from encounters as a backup. It's just to screw you over during bosses, and those are the worst worst worst the series has ever seen. Artificial is the only way to look at it.


reaper527

> Agreed. The CP system was absolutely awful. I can't believe there are people that enjoy it. > > > > You have healing tied to CP which can only be restored by Orange Gels. Orange Gels can be purchased for 3000 per. To stock up on orange gels, you need to spend 45K on 15 IN addition to purchasing other stuff like equipment and other items. It felt like the developers artificially made the game harder and tried to incentivize the player to make in game purchases. It's so blatantly obvious that I very much hate a lot of the things that Namco bandai did with the game. to be fair, poorly balanced orange gel pricing isn't inherently a flaw with the cp system. it's a flaw with the game as a whole and you hit the nail on the head that it was bamco being greedy trying to get microtransaction revenue. the concept of the cp system is fine, the issue is the balancing of costs. (like, out of battle actions costing 75cp+ is absurd and never should have been a thing)


KREEDBREED

I can't really remember the cp system giving me any problems by itself. The only thing that was annoying was the price of orange gels. Shionne is the most fun healer iv played in any tales and I think this is a byproduct of cp system.


Takazura

Have you played Hearts R or Innocence R? Both of those have 3-4 characters that can functions as healers and are all fun to play as they also work well offensively, and they use the CC and TP system respectively. I would say it moreso depends on how they design the healer themself rather than what resource system they are using.


POWAHFLOW

I disagree somewhat with your points. In terms of artes, I say there should be a way to have access to your entire moveset. Even in Vesperia with 16, there were still times I wished I could do a certain arte but there was no space for it because all the other artes I had were useful. Yes I could just go into a menu and temporarily replace an arte with the one I need but that's tedious. After playing Destiny DC and even Tales of the World: RM3, spamming healing doesn't matter if they come out too slow or the healer doesn't have the resources to cast it. I agree that healing should be limited because enemy attacks don't matter if you can heal it back quickly but in return, one-shots shouldn't exist (which I've seen plenty of in Arise, but to be fair, there are one-shots in a lot of the Tales games) and I feel the CP system just adds a very small hurtle and doesn't solve the core issue. I think they could also make healing overall weaker which would cause the burden of not dying to be dependant on player skill over whether or not a heal spell came out fast enough and computer controlled party members should take less damage or the devs need to figure out how to make the AI not face tank everything like they would in Eternia or Destiny DC. Lastly, I agree that perks should stay but like someone else in the thread said, perks have always existed in the Tales series. Some examples: Phantasia: Cress is the main melee (aside from Suzu and Rondoline). Destiny DC: Stahn, Leon, and Woodrow are all good with both melee and magic, however, Stahn is great at keeping enemies airborne, Leon has access to tons of artes with lots of utility and Woodrow can use all 3 forms of attack: melee, ranged and magic. Eternia: Reid is the toughest (aside from Max and at times, Farah lol) and has a very flexible moveset but he can't chain artes as well as Farah can which Farah's somewhat long combos keep enemies in hitstun longer so that they can't always fight back. Movesets (like in a fighting game) are also perks within themselves because what a character has access to determines what combos they can do and how they synergize with the rest of the party. Tales' combat is heavily inspired from fighting games, a great example being Khang in Destiny DC where he literally has movement tech like Potemkin from Guilty Gear.


-SeraWasNever-

I like the campfires for food, shopping, bonding, random skits. It's useful and also makes it seem like they are genuinely travelling across a vast world. Similarly I enjoyed Vesperia sometimes having scenes when sleeping at an inn. Something about it helps make the characters feel like they live in that world, for me.


DaemonDesiree

That was a huuuge drawback for me because it seemed like they put a majority of the small moments for the characters into the campfires. I miss after battle skits at least and bigger overworld skits at most.


-SeraWasNever-

I'd love those back too! I agree with you that too much was loaded into the campfires, but would still like the mechanic to return, just more balanced out.


DaemonDesiree

I can see that. But only with a cast that actually seems like they give a modicum of a crap about each other. They have the same mechanicish in Dragon Quest XI (I’m VERRRY early game) but because you actually move much faster across the overworld, the awkward fireside chats don’t feel so heavy.


somethingsome11

~~You already get 12 artes with the artifact.~~ They need to make it 16+ and bring back arte/spell chaining because 12 still feels limiting. Edit: Sorry, I misunderstood. Arise is still pretty underwhelming with 12 artes compared to past titles. Vesperia gives you 16 artes. Zestiria and Berseria give you access to 7~8 artes in the first attack, but you can also chain those artes into higher-tier artes, effectively doubling your options to 14~16 for the 2nd attack and onwards. Technically more since 1 spell can chain into 2 or 3 more spells. Edit 2: Er woops, I forgot you can't chain martial artes in Zestiria, so it'd be like 11~16 or so depending on how you count spells


Jay_RPGee

Original Vesperia was 8, and even in the PS3/DE version the artes ball is quite easily missed or not bothered with. 12 is definitely not underwhelming vs. most of the series, especially considering how quickly and easily you can switch the character you're controlling in-combat in Arise - in other entries, a portion of your equippable artes are shortcuts which you can assign other party member's artes to so you have some control of your party because you cannot quick swap. Number of artes is neither here nor there though. The number of equippable artes is dependant on the combat system as a whole. Every entry has had new gimmicks and different takes on the LMBS since Graces, some are arte-heavy like Xillia 2 and others are gimmick heavy like Zestiria. Arise has 12 equippable artes but also has boost strikes which is like having another 4 group artes equipped as shortcuts. Number of equippable artes isn't really an important metric anymore, not since we moved on from the classic/bare LMBS of the Symphonia era.


Likes2game03

You are correct sir. Games like Dragon Quest XI have taught me you don't need to reinvent the wheel. That's why I said 12, it seems just right.


somethingsome11

I unlocked the arte ball as soon as I could, and I'd wager most people unlocked it in their first playthrough. Which synthesis materials make it easily missable? I don't remember the material requirements but even if you could miss something, it's not locked off forever when you get >!Ba'ul!<, and the game gives you free DLC with synthesis materials. I think it's silly to ignore the arte ball in this discussion though just because it's optional. Arte slots are a big deal in Tales because the bulk of the combat comes from chaining artes. The more arte slots, the more options you have for combos. It's the bread and butter of Tales lol. The gimmicks and combat systems change with each new entry but comboing artes will always be a central part of the combat. Also, since you brought it up, how many artes do you get to choose from in Graces F and the Xillia games? I haven't played those. Boost strikes are the finishers, so I'm assuming you meant boost attacks? Those are KINDA like having extra attacks, but they're only good against certain enemies in certain situations, except for Alphen's BA. They're not something you'd just toss out into a combo unless you want to refill your AG. Edit: Also, even if you disagree with 12 being underwhelming, there's nothing wrong with adding more slots or the ability to chain artes. Limiting it to 12 is just an arbitrary restriction imo and neglects some of the advances we've made with previous games.


Jay_RPGee

I confused the arte ball in Vesperia with the arte sphere in Xillia, my bad. In Xillia the arte expansion is easily missed because it's an item you need to trade a collectable for at a specific NPC. Xillia is like Vesperia DE, it's 4 artes + 4 shortcuts x2. Graces is 8 (4 + 4 shortcuts) but Graces is the first game to make chaining artes a major part of the system. The bulk of Tales combat systems are not about chaining artes, they're about combos (normal attack combo > arte > mystic arte, for example). Graces, Zestiria, and Berseria removed normal attacks in favour of the arte tree so those games are absolutely about chaining artes together but their systems are the most different from the series as a whole. And that's what I meant by the number of artes not really mattering. In Xillia 2 you can equip 48 artes at the same time because that's how the system was designed. In Arise you can equip 12 artes + normal attack combo + boost attacks (& other gimmicks), some systems have more artes but no normal attacks, some have artes and normal attacks but no gimmicks. The number of artes you can equip is not a metric you can attribute a good or bad value to because you have to look at what the entire system has to offer. For example: How would you have more than 12 artes in Arise? Like physically how would you map that on a controller? Between normal attacks, a jump button (necessary for the bigger focus on mid-air combat), boost attacks (I did mix them up with boost strikes in the first post, my bad), artes, and the arte modifier to get access to the other 6, where would you fit another 4 artes? This is what I mean by looking at the entire system.


somethingsome11

The combos you do are largely comprised of artes though. I'm not denying that there's other things you can mix into them. Artes are just a large part of them. Even taking Arise's entire combat into account, your choices to combo enemies still feels underwhelming outside of the 12 artes. Basic attacks, boost attacks, and mystic artes are cool but as a total package, I'd like more than that. Some characters like Alphen have extra attacking options but it's not equal treatment among every character. Actually, mage characters have it kinda rough because they only have 6 slots to balance between spells and ground attacks. > For example: How would you have more than 12 artes in Arise? Like physically how would you map that on a controller? Like I said: Arte/spell chaining. Have I been calling it the wrong thing? Lol. The thing from Zestiria and Berseria where you hold the arte button down and it chains into a higher-tier version of that arte. Alphen can already do it to use his blazing sword artes but give that function to other characters so they can access more artes or unique attacks.


[deleted]

I played through all of Vesperia DE using a missables guide and I have no idea what the hell the arte ball you're talking about is. That term never once came up in any media I looked up about the game.


somethingsome11

It's called "artes sphere" in-game. It's that synthesis item that gives you an extra 8 slots to place artes. I'm just used to people calling it arte ball online.


InfernoCommander

Only easily missed if you're a doofus who doesn't synthesize. Same folks probably went the whole game without OL3 as well 🤣


Takazura

I would also get rid of splitting it up between only being 6 for ground artes and 6 for air artes. It just felt too limiting to me, especially when playing Shionne or Dohalim and having to use up 1-2 of the ground arte spots for healing/support stuff.


Dragon-uninstall

I know other games has voice lines before the mystic arte. But doing a combo with Alphen just to hear:"I have no limits!!" Makes me more hyped to continue the combo and destroy a wolf with the Mystical Arte


reaper527

the concept on CP is nice, but it needs tweaking. the balancing is kind of a mess. using CP outside of combat to open doorways is WAY too expensive. also, the buffs don't last anywhere near long enough to justify their CP costs (not to mention you pretty much have to disable and micromanage them anyways because of the terrible ai, otherwise you'll always be out of cp). not being able to heal because someone ai controlled wasted all the party's CP isn't a good thing. definitely agree on the 12 arts though, as long as they remove the limits and let me set whatever i want rather than forcing certain slots to be air (regardless it felt like i was only ever using 3 or 4 of them). as it stands, berseria felt like it gave a lot more freedom/utility to map artes


WittyFault6988

Number 4 was in team symphonia. Also I prefer mystic artes not being avoidable and you have to try your best to either pervert it, avoid it them when they in overlimit or use the artes that can activate the mystic arte, or use artes that can help you withstand mystic artes. Most of the enemy mystic artes in the game are laughable with only Ganabelt feeling more fun while sword art online boss fight is just BS. Also number 3 is basically ever tales games? It always been awarded to try other characters. I'm not trying to sound rude but most of these had always been or been in a tales prior


jizzle701

I don’t agree with 2 and 5 but everything else is nice


Hayaros

I want another mage that allows me to fuse spells to get a new one!! Rinwell was so fun to play as :c


KREEDBREED

Rinwell is the most fun I've had playing a mage in this series so I definitely want her character perk to return.