T O P
CrimsonLancet

I have always found it absurd how Switzerland gets away with building the cornerstone of its entire economy around providing banking services to the most sinister criminals from all over the world, including genocidal dictators, human traffickers, drug lords, etc. The public [promptly forgot the latest Credit Suisse scandal](https://www.theguardian.com/news/2022/feb/20/credit-suisse-secrets-leak-unmasks-criminals-fraudsters-corrupt-politicians) revealed last February, obviously because of the horrific assault against Ukraine.


curiossceptic

Do you really believe that this is the cornerstone of the entire Swiss economy?


voyagerdoge

is it cheese fondue?


curiossceptic

Only ca. 0.3% of Swiss exports are cheese, unsure how much of it is cheese traditionally used for cheese fondue. Switzerland has one of the most complex/diversified economies, there are many different industries that contribute to its success, mostly pharma, chemical products, high precision machinery, medical equipment, precious metal trade, watches, perfumes, etc.


TheCaspica

It definitely was instrumental to build the prosperous economy it is today and continues to be an important part of the Swiss economy. 28% of all offshore assets are estimated to be in Switzerland.


mark-haus

Don't forget Nestle, one of the most evil companies in the world, literally enclosing public resources in foreign countries and reselling them at a premium


CrimsonLancet

[And enabling the murder of union leaders in South America](https://www.ecchr.eu/en/case/nestle-precedent-case-murder-of-trade-unionist-romero-in-colombia/).


mark-haus

And convincing mothers that they're bad mothers for breastfeeding their kids when in reality their formula is no substitute for the microbes in breast milk causing a massive spike in Africa's infant mortality rate. I can't stress enough just how psychotic nestle is [https://www.nber.org/papers/w24452](https://www.nber.org/papers/w24452)


gH0st_in_th3_Machin3

Nestlé is also Swiss... Roche is also Swiss...


s3rila

what's Roche ?


curiossceptic

One of the largest pharmaceutical companies in the world (by revenue). Novartis is also up there in the top 5 or so, also Swiss.


gH0st_in_th3_Machin3

I mentioned Roche because one of the executives tied to the Credit Suisse scandals **also** sits on the executive board at Roche. And Roche has already been fined by the FDA in the past...


curiossceptic

And? Feel free to continue your train of thought…


Frenchbaguette123

Glencore is also Swiss...


untergeher_muc

But they are so tiny and cute and speak funny. You have to understand.


BkkGrl

yup, I remember it being revealed the same day of the invasion


corporate_power

it includes a lot of politicians and businesses from all over


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curiossceptic

Never happened in the first place. That's an urban legend.


TawanaBrawley

I mean, they knew where the gold was coming from though.


curiossceptic

What is your evidence for that claim?


TawanaBrawley

https://www.nytimes.com/1996/12/14/world/swiss-acknowledge-profiting-from-nazi-gold.html


curiossceptic

That article doesn’t support your claims.


TawanaBrawley

Are you asking me to prove they took gold from teeth, or just that they took gold that came from Jews? Obviously the Nazis melted it all into bars. It's not like the Swiss paid reparations for no reason at all.


curiossceptic

You made two specific claims: 1. That Swiss banks accepted gold teeth 2. That Swiss banks knew where some of the gold "was coming from", implying that Swiss banks knew that some of the gold was coming from gold teeth - or from Jewish victims in general I think we both agree that point 1 is incorrect, and for point 2 you have not provided any source.


asreagy

Colour me not surprised, Switzerland doing its thing. Money above all.


curiossceptic

>Although an additional CHF2.2 billion were blocked, CHF3.4 billion were released again **after being frozen on a precautionary** basis. > >\[...\] > >Swiss banks and asset managers can **provisionally** freeze funds but funds **need to be released if they cannot establish that the assets are directly owned or controlled** by a sanctioned individual. > >Switzerland could not simply freeze funds if it did not have “sufficient grounds”, said Bollinger. > >[source](https://www.swissinfo.ch/eng/switzerland-releases-chf3-billion-of-frozen-russia-sanctions/47590508?utm_campaign=teaser-in-channel&utm_source=swissinfoch&utm_medium=display&utm_content=o)


Oyddjayvagr

The only comment with facts has 3 upvotes, a comment directly bashing switzerland has over 300 upvotes. A normal day in r/europe


caerulus01

Pls delete this. Facts are not allowed here


kittensmeowalot

They could have easily changed their own rules, but didn't.


curiossceptic

should laws be changed to allow freezing assets without establishing ownership? Should every Russian asset be frozen?


kittensmeowalot

Why not, they are invading another country.


curiossceptic

Not every Russian is pro-war, pro-Putin, etc…not every Russian is on a sanctions list.


kittensmeowalot

What does it matter, by harming the entire nation you cause hardships and slow the economy. The entire point of sanctions.


curiossceptic

Are you serious? So, in your opinion, every Russian should be sanctioned?


kittensmeowalot

Why not. Russians started this war.


curiossceptic

In that case you should take up that fight with the EU, the US and the international community in general - and not Switzerland specifically. No country is just seizing any Russian assets - but only assets from sanctioned individuals, banks, etc. - luckily there are still laws and standards to be followed.


SomeRedditWanker

It really didn't take much for the war in Ukraine to fall out of the news cylce, and politicians to magically stop giving a fuck anymore about sanctioning Russia. Just today we've had EU eyeing up ditching the Russian oil ban, and now this. Funny how those two things go hand in hand, isnt it? Falling out of the news cycle (and peoples interest), so politicians no longer feel and pressure to actually do anything. Will see more of this as the weeks go on. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Eht1MLU3r5A


Major_Boot2778

So then the question is, what can we do to pull it back in the news cycle? I know in Germany some things that could be done would be, for example, translating more of the horror stories into German rather than just English, and getting Melnyk gone and replaced by someone louder, more professional, and more charismatic. Beyond that, the war is slowing down and so are the available headlines. How do we keep steam, and how to we pressure our national news outlets?


EvilFroeschken

It is inevitable. Would be wise from a Russian side if their supporters would sit tight and Russia wouldn't sent out threats every week. Than the media coverage would fade out in a month. The war coverage on my news feed is alteady diminishing. It's still on top but just 2 articles. The elections are covered and for an unknown reason Boris Becker takes like 25% of the page. Only escalation would bring back attention unfortunately. The underlying problem is the link to arms support. No ammunition for Gepard. So just 7 artillery pieces in total were dozens of armored vehicles are destroyed on a daily bases. It doesn't feel like the speeches are backed by actions and a long term supply strategy. I guarantee the 100bn and 2% will slowly fade into darkness over time.


Bowlnk

It only wells up again whenever Russia commits yet another warcrime.


respscorp

Unfortunately, no. Russia commits multiple war-crimes daily and threatens Europe on a daily basis. If this falls out of the news cycle, it's because media has been convince to move on. E.g. by certain politicians who are getting worried about having to actually face the consequences of their collusion with Russia over the past 20 years.


respscorp

There's a massive circle of Russia-owned media and politicians all over Europe. The only thing that can be done is to organise, especially in countries like Germany and keep the fire lit under the politicians feet.


Major_Boot2778

I agree, and that's one of the big problems (though for all our difficulties I'd personally use Hungary or one of the other wholly-under-the-influence examples before Germany; and it's not just Europe, the West in general has been infiltrated, including the US. Google Yuri Bezmenov if ya have a spare couple mins or I can post a relevant video if you're interested).... Russia has spent **decades** infiltrating our public information sectors and it feels like our governments are by and large just burying their heads in the sand on that front. At the very least they're being reactive when they should be being proactive, incentivizing truth in media and pushing stories that run directly contra to the Russian line. They've done it in such covert ways, the self loathing Westerner and self loathing human being trends are particularly irksome. We've seen what nationalism can do in terms of morale and willingness to fight for country, whether taken to evil ends or not - Russia's goal has been to affect the opposite of nationalism in the populations of Western countries, to soften us up to the idea that we'd be better off lead by someone else.


mark-haus

Gary Kasparov too has been sounding this alarm for years. Personal hero of mine


Major_Boot2778

Good name drop, I'll look into him, thank you


Ninja_Thomek

It’s why Germany dragging their feet was so insanely enraging. These political momentum’s and moments don’t last forever. It’s like trying to wake someone who really just wants to just go back to sleep..


Major_Boot2778

That's fair. I think Germany got a lot more shit than they deserved and weren't given credit where it was due, but, we did indeed need to be doing more, and a hell of a lot faster, and that remains true today.


Novinhophobe

It might have been harsh but it’s hard to put forward a convincing argument how it was unfounded or undeserved. The shitty situation the whole of Europe is in right now is because of Germany.


Major_Boot2778

No, that perspective is absolute bullshit, and has been debunked many times as well as having literally been counter productive. Lol dude beats up his wife and you blame the guy down the street. Not even gonna argue with you, just call ya an idiot and be on my way.


Neversetinstone

>So then the question is, what can we do to pull it back in the news cycle? Apply the sanctions to Swiss institutions for breaking the sanctions.


curiossceptic

Countries do not freeze Russian assets if they cannot sufficiently establish that it's owned or controlled by a sanctioned person, Switzerland is no different in that case to any other country, so why would you want to sanction Switzerland specifically?


Major_Boot2778

Switzerland is heading the direction of Hungary in my eyes. I'll never vote and will actively encourage against measures supporting Hungary going into the future unless a drastic 180 in policy and social awareness happens, which must include Orban being gone and a 100% absence of Russian influence.


SomeRedditWanker

Go out and protest the lifting of sanctions, I guess.


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Major_Boot2778

This is literally what's been being reported, that it's slowing down as Putin engages a strategy for the long game. Even the troop losses seem less than before, and there isn't a Bucha style sensation to piss everyone off freshly (not saying there should be, if they quit doing that shit then it's a blessing). Whether it's actually slowing or not is immaterial regarding the media reporting about it.


VisNihil

Did you read the article? Assets that were ***provisionally*** frozen are being released. They need evidence to permanently seize assets.


kittensmeowalot

How is it falling out of the news cycle, literally front page news to this day.


gogo_yubari-chan

> Just today we've had EU eyeing up ditching the Russian oil ban the EU didn't eye up anything. The oil ban can't pass because Hungary is vetoing it and the ban has to be approved unanimously. The only thing we can do is to ban russian oil state by state.


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Amazing_Examination6

>Time to reinstate borders with them, tbh. What do you mean, "reinstate"?


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Amazing_Examination6

No, I actually dont. Your comment doesn't make it clear whether you mean checks on persons or goods. >Switzerland has been a member of the Schengen Area since 12 December 2008. > >Applicable to all Schengen member states, the Schengen Association Agreement stipulates that short stays may not exceed 90 days in any 180-day period. This agreement is specifically intended to facilitate the travel of tourists, visitors and business travellers for these brief periods of stay. > >The agreement also stipulates that > >**as a rule**, there are **no border checks on persons** at the internal borders of Schengen member states; > >\[...\] > >Information about customs and goods inspection > >**The Schengen Association Agreement has no impact on the activities of Swiss customs**. Since Switzerland is not a member of the EU Customs Union (EUCU), customs and goods inspection will continue at Swiss external and internal borders. In connection with these customs and goods inspections (e.g. to ascertain the origin and destination of goods) and for personal protection, **checks on persons may also be carried out if necessary**. [https://www.sem.admin.ch/sem/en/home/themen/einreise/einreise-ch-schengen.html](https://www.sem.admin.ch/sem/en/home/themen/einreise/einreise-ch-schengen.html) So, you want to reinstate border checks on persons?


MaximumPositive6471

Yup, the free-rider problem is very real in modern Europe and often ignored by those that go on-and-on about national sovereignty, usually from a position of privilege. Almost every crisis in the last decade, it's always been a handful of countries that had to take the physical brunt for the majority. The worst and most morally questionable so far, there are many, was Spain and Italian health services being forced into austerity just to be overwhelmed by Covid.


EDoro

I'm getting really tired of you Switzerland. Stop backstabbing your "allies" for personal gains just because you're a tiny dot between other mighty nations acting as "walls".


Minimum_T-Giraff

Even Switzerland is bound by laws. Like the article says they can't simply keep assets frozen without evidence. Otherwise it would be asset forfeiture without due processes


nevetz1911

I can't say I haven't spent another day wishing Switzerland to get invaded and split between its neighbourhood


curiossceptic

The fact that comments like these get upvoted tells a lot about the state of this sub.


nevetz1911

The fact that comments like these are written tells a lot about the disinformation around the danger of keeping nations like Switzerland around in the globalization era


DiarrheaMonsterr

Based. Found Gaddafi's secret reddit account.


kittensmeowalot

How to become the most hated European nation in 3 easy steps!


voyagerdoge

You'd think they'd have learnt something from their appaling behavior during ww2.


CataVlad21

Hope everyone takes their money outta their banks! Greedy azz bastards!


alupeguspx99

Pretty much to be expected.


thrallsius

special financial leakage