T O P
ErrantRailer

Investigating this! Thank you for reporting!


Tractie

Ah shit, this is bad :( We might get a delay on ranked modes then


VanillaCupkake

Or worse, we won’t


3scap3plan

in a way this is actually good for the game - imagine how embarrassing it will be when official VGC tournaments either have to be delayed, cancelled etc. It might just be the thing GF need to get their arse in gear to fix the games.


BarelyHereLMAO

Or TPC to maybe finally cut down on crunch and give GF more of a budget and time to make a functional game


Lewser

I have been seeing this around so much but to set the record straight, Game Freak owns 1/3 of TPC. It's the other way around, TPC is largely just a publishing company and have rights and licensing to games that are not made on consoles (pokemon go, pokemon masters. etc). Creatures, Nintendo, and GameFreak created TPC. TPC did not create game freak nor are they, their overlord. If crunch did occur for this game, it was more than likely self-imposed. I understand people want to defend Pokemon and enjoy SV but this misinformation has to stop. You are allowed to lack the game despite its flaws but don't use justifications to try to absolve GameFreak of deserved criticism. Game Freak rejected help from nintendo in creating this game, so the faults are on their own. Not excepting help from studios like Monolith Soft and Nintendo EPD was a very arrogant stance. Had they had these extra resources they could spend more time fixing the code for their battles. Pokemon will sell regardless of what state it's in because the fans and newcomers love pokemon. It's extremely marketable but you refusing to hold GameFreak responsible while still enjoying the game is not helping anything.


Shoranos

Game Freak owns the games, but Creatures is the one in charge of *merch*, which is like 80% of the franchise's worth. That would give them a lot of power within TPC. Editing because u/Erimgard responded and then blocked me to try and prevent me from continuing any discussion—My point is that GF may very well be unable to delay the games because of Creatures. The release schedules for merch are tied to those of the games, and with the merch being the source of the vast majority of the profit, they would almost certainly take priority.


Erimgard

What are you even proposing? That the people who come up with toy designs at Creatures should go on strike until Game Freak......... hires more people to a company they don't even work at? Delays their next game? Promises a full Pokedex? Why would anyone on Creatures do that?


Jumpy_Level3348

he's suggesting the people who make the toy and clothing deals with distrubtors have a very specific schedule and want the games to fall in line with that. star wars makes way more money as a brand than as a film, because of merchandise. it's obviously the same for pokemon.


MegaTorterra220

Holy cow, they refused help from Monolith Soft? Seriously? It's like a middle schooler refusing help from a college professor because "they don't need their help"


Crazy_Ad1487

If they did refuse or turn down help from other developers/companies/whatever, it was probably because they would then have to share the game's profit or credit with those other developers. Which I feel like they would never be willing to do. They'd rather own 100% of the profit (or as much as they can) of a mediocre game than 80% of the profit of a terrific game, especially when people are gonna buy it regardless of quality.


Lewser

It’s pretty insane. It’s because Game Freak Values smaller teams because it has “better communication” it doesn’t help that a lot of times they do get assistance they prefer newer talent with little to bo experience. When you add in that game freak themselves even say that their strong suit is 2d and sprite a disaster forms easily. Since a lot of the new people they add on are let go at tge end of the project you always have basically a brand new team working on each subsequent title. It creates a lot of inconsistencies.


NoPenNameGirl

Maybe they know the games will sell anyways, thats why they're arrogant. And at the end of the day, they're right. Pokemon games sell well no matter the content.


[deleted]

[удалено]


Lewser

Really? I can't find any information about this occurring. I know that historically Game Freak largely never asks for help from other devs and like "newer talent". Since they constantly contract newer talent a lot of the bulk of the games coding are done by newbies in the game industry while the vision is led by all Game Freak big heads. Looking at the staffing that was on the game all executive positions from UI, World Design, and art direction are all helmed by Game Freak execs. On top of this a game I know for sure they are helping is Tears of the Kingdom and it's hard to imagine that they are able to help create a game that visually stunning and at the same time be responsible for Scarlet and Violet. If I am wrong, I'll admit that, but I see no evidence that they had a hand in the development of SV and I would like to know how big of an influence they had if they did.


BarelyHereLMAO

I'm not refusing to hold GF responsible?? I literally didn't know GF owned any part of TPC until this comment. No need to be so damn hostile, good lord. I have plenty of gripes with the game and lack of budget and all of the crunch, but as my username suggests, I'm barely here.


Lewser

Not hostile just a bit assertive. But saying something wrong and then immediately getting defensive when hit with the facts is lazy. Again I don’t expect everyone to know the ins and outs of the company but if that’s the case maybe you shouldn’t blindly speculate and just observe this from a distance. Not here to attack you or “own” anyone.


BarelyHereLMAO

You know, a simple "Actually GF owns paet of TPC, so that's incorrect. Here's the actual facts" is a hell of a lot better than being rude about it and calling someone who doesn't know lazy, or telling them to "observe from a distance". You *can* correct people nicely.


FrostyPotpourri

Just a random passerby and I had to chime in that you're easily being the rude one here. u/Lewser was never rude -- perhaps matter-of-factly, but never rude. Your responses to them have been *far* more rude than you claim them to be and it honestly looks like you conjured something out of nothing. Learn to be okay with someone correcting you and providing clarity on the matter. I'm sure there have been times when people have been rude to you, but this isn't one of them.


Erimgard

Game Freak owns TCPI not the other way around. Game Freak, Nintendo, and Creatures each own 33% of The Pokemon Company International, which itself is just a marketing brand, not a decision-making entity.


BarelyHereLMAO

Thank you for nicely explaining and correcting me and helping me learn and be more aware of the situation. It doesn't happen often. Then it falls mostly on Nintendo to provide more budget/less crunch on GF and Creatures? Or is all the work on GF?


_Dague_

Give them a break, they are a small indie company.


Concerned_mayor

On the plus side, maybe I'll find time to finish the game before ranked begins


jugol

or maybe this is why ranked didn't start straight away


Tractie

I've heard from others that ranked historically starts on Decemeber 1st


jugol

Yes it does. Oh I mixed up the start for rankeds (december) with the start for online tournaments (spring) according to the website. This can't start in 4 days, it's a very, very bad fuck up.


potatoshulk

This is a pretty easy fix no? It's not great it's in the game but changing the seed to random can't be that hard


Singularity3

It certainly *should* be, but it ultimately depends on how well that functionality can be isolated. For most other dev teams this would be a cakewalk, but…Game Freak is known for making some odd programming decisions lol


leafofthelake

A bigger issue than fixing the problem is the mandatory testing that will go into *any* change that will see release, which will necessarily delay a fix. This might be fixable in an afternoon by one developer, but take 2+ weeks of testing before players actually see it. You might say "but what about the buggy mess that is the rest of the game?" Indeed, it's in fact possible that we would've gotten *fewer* bugs if there was *less* testing, as the devs would have been allowed to keep making changes to the code for longer before release. But, it's also possible we could've gotten something completely gamebreaking (like erasing people's save files levels of gamebreaking). After a certain point, devs aren't *allowed* to fix minor bugs. Once you get close to release (or are releasing patches post-release, in this case), devs will tend to be incredibly cautious about fixing *anything,* because they don't want to accidentally break something worse than what it started as. Which is why you tend to see a fast turnaround on only the worst bugs, since if the bug is considered bad enough, it's hard to do more damage with your fix than the bug is already doing by being in the game. Meanwhile, with more minor bugs (like the many graphical issues in SV), devs will delay a fix until they've done more than sufficient testing to ensure the build is stable. Will this be considered a high priority fix? Probably. But only time will tell.


retro_and_chill

Seeding the RNG is one line. Most of the time spent resolving that is finding the error and waiting on the build pipeline.


ThatOneRandomGuy101

Fake Out + Sheer Cold = 100% Accuracy


Lord-Trolldemort

Leading a ghost type with a scarf or access to priority is gonna be a must so you can force sheer cold to be the third move. This is so stupid lmao


Rain_Moon

It is indeed a case of fixed RNG. We can abuse it by making Sheer Cold (or other OHKO moves) guaranteed to hit when used at the right time! Air Slash + Sheer Cold seems to always work as long as the opponent doesn't move before you.


Ok-Fudge8848

Good god...


Techiedelic

Tailwind sheer cold team, here I come!


Boomerwell

Does this apply with Crits as well I've felt like there have been a significant increase in Crits I've taken and given. Before it was like once every 2 battles I'd see one now it's like every battle.


darkszero

It probably does. Every single random aspect of a battle would be set by the same random number generator, which is being fed a static seed.


ssnover95x

Similar to the eye tracking RNG manipulation for BDSP, it's likely that you could create a tool which could take sequences of events that trigger RNG checks and it could back out exact results for every following RNG event (lots of things hit this check so control would be limited, but not hard to keep accurate).


Khaytra

Hm. I mean it is *technically* possible to miss a 90% 14 times in a row but it is some extreme kinda luck... If you're very sure something strange is happening, try getting ahold of DaWoblefet on twitter or on Smogon. He's always testing mechanic minutiae and stuff on his streams. You've got evidence of it happening, so he's more likely to take it seriously and might spend some time working it out with you.


DaWoblefet

I'm actually not the best candidate here, but I have reached out to the people who would be. Unfortunately, I can reproduce what the OP finds.


PuzzleheadedWave1486

Everything’s technically possible but this is so unlikely that that the odds of this happening in a (correctly calculating) single In game battle in the 25 years this game has existed are still almost 0.


PuzzleheadedWave1486

I’ve noticed similar things in my play through and usually clumped together. There is no convincing me that there’s not a large backend error going on, had a friend mention smth similar. Like when I was doing poisen star base went in and realized was under leveled so thought I would get wiped. Clicked bite and it flinched 9 times in a row and 6 of them crit. Genuinely impossible odds. Had a wide lens maushold miss the first population bomb (99% accuracy) not Probably 8 out of 10 times in a battle. A few times have noticed when I miss even a 90% accuracy move once then the next few seem to miss at a much higher rate, clumps of 5-6 have been common.


ParanoidDrone

My Gardevoir's Hypnosis is similarly streaky. If it misses, it'll generally miss for the next several turns in a row. Annoying when trying to catch wild Pokemon.


legacyxi

I thought I was going crazy using Gallade and Hypnosis as well. It seemed strange how often the miss streaks occurred.


-Phinocio

Same with my Gallade


liteshadow4

Okay well this happened to me in gen 5. If I miss a will-o-wisp I'd miss like 3 in a row.


MegaTorterra220

Same for my Meowscarada's Play Rough


Khaosundivided

I use my Tinkaton almost exclusively for Tera raids and I can say that since I got the game on launch, I haven't missed a Play Rough yet. I know there were other issues with Play Rough in raids, where it didn't show the correct damage dealt, but as far as I can tell, the accuracy is 100%


MegaTorterra220

Who are you, so wise in the ways of luck?


Low_Cartographer_920

I had similar things on my playthrough. Flinched 3-5 times in a row by NPC, myself being able to flinch 3-5 rows ect... This game was not released in a finished state.


Ok-Fudge8848

If this is true (and evidence is suggesting it can be duplicated) then this is a *disaster* for competitive. How did this happen? Did they recreate the whole game from scratch? As if there haven't been over 25 years of other games to pull from? This is actually worse than the graphical issues. If the RNG is fixed then battles can be manipulated, and players will figure out some insane glitch to always hit sheer cold or something. Yikes.


acquire-eggs

Haven’t tried it myself but there’s another comment saying sheer cold always hits after an air slash if an opponent isn’t moving first


Ok-Fudge8848

Yeah saw that about 30 mins after making this comment. It also works after fake out. People move fast. RIP competitive.


acquire-eggs

Probably won’t play until this gets fixed tbh


floofis

They were probably using a fixed seed for testing and forgot to make it random again. It's a dumb mistake but the devs were obviously rushed as fuck. They're not as stupid as you think they are


Nachttalk

Man, just WTF happend behind closed doors here? This is the second-most broken game in the series, which is bad considering that it's only beaten by a game that let's you reprogram itself. Something like this doesn't just happen just like that. Something went terribly wrong and I wanna know what it was, even tough I will never know


smelldigan

theyve been making a game about once a year for almost a decade on a not very big staff. also iirc (dont quote me on this) the team was further split for PLA and this release. so theres just increasing fatigue and less and less time to do stuff


ssnover95x

Honestly so much of the engine code should already be done with the only real change for battle engine this gen being terastalizing which doesn't seem like it should be a huge change. It's hard to imagine how this type of bug would make its way into production code. Seeding randomness ought to be dependency injected to allow testing but to also prevent bugs like OP posted. EDIT: Saw a comment in associated Twitter thread that syncing the engines between the two games requires them to share a seed so I'm starting to believe that the handshake for deriving that seed could pretty easily have a mistake in it, not a problem I've ever had to deal with before so it hadn't occurred to me.


Shoranos

It's called being overworked and having rigid timetables.


leafofthelake

Definitely the least polished, that's for sure. Not sure if it's actually second most broken, considering RBY isn't alone in its ACE exploit (GSC has one too, thanks to the coin case). I'd give it a solid third place though. For just how riddled with bugs RBY was, and just how broken it could be if you really pulled it apart, I think SV's bugs are more likely to be noticed by the player. The graphical bugs are instantly recognizable, and the E4 music bug is notorious for causing a bad gameplay experience in a pivotal part of the game. Conversely, you could play RBY from start to finish and it's likely that the worst bug you'll encounter is a gen 1 miss or the badge boost glitch (the latter of which always benefits the player). In that sense, RBY was a more polished final product than SV is.


Ok-Fudge8848

Yeah sorry, I know they're not stupid, sorry it could come across that way. It's precisely because they're not stupid that I'm shocked this has happened. This is a really rookie error to come from a professional game developer, and it's wild to think that it could happen in Pokémon of all franchises. I think we can all agree the issue is rushing out these games, and I hope the devs are able to take more time developing them in future.


SlimDirtyDizzy

It already happened. Air slash into sheer cold is 100% accurate if you move before your opponent


Ok-Fudge8848

So is Fake Out into Sheer Cold. RIP competitive.


DaWoblefet

Many have likely seen this by now, but Anubis confirms your findings - Battle Stadium uses a static RNG seed. Isn't that lovely? https://twitter.com/Sibuna\_Switch/status/1596768465095983104


EnglishMobster

Fixed link: https://twitter.com/Sibuna_Switch/status/1596768465095983104


Xurkitree1

The RNG seed is currently static and the same for all battles. I've seen RNG manipulated battles which ensure OHKO moves hit every turn they're used. - https://twitter.com/Sibuna_Switch/status/1596768465095983104


Mauntra

This would be disastrous if it were the case, wouldn't it? Is it just Frost Breath or do other moves share this behaviour? Anecdotally I haven't noticed anything like that in the battles I've watched, though I haven't played any against other players myself yet.


Lord-Trolldemort

Update: It's all moves. I just caught heat wave missing my left target, which I believe is the first check [https://imgur.com/a/Ml4qryZ](https://imgur.com/a/Ml4qryZ) I also watched all of CybertronVGC's youtube battles and in this video ([https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kQKs1Nf794&t=906s](https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2kQKs1Nf794&t=906s)) battle 1 starts out with a missed heat wave (left target) and game 2 starts with a missed will-o-wisp. None of the other opening moves are less than 95% accurate, though icy wind (95%) does hit every time


adamspecial

Am I crazy, or pokésports missed every first population bomb in this video? https://youtu.be/3CImiPevdFI


H2instinct

Exactly. Something is hella wrong here.


3cmPanda

This is a huge bug if it is consistent


mantiseye

If this is true, I have no idea how this even could happen. There are a few weird bugs I’ve seen, like the game not updating HP bars after ally switch, but once you understand that it makes sense. This is almost like accuracy is reversed for one turn? Would be super weird


GrafEisen

It's not accuracy being reversed - think of it that there's a deck of 52 playing cards, and if a queen is drawn the move misses. The order of the cards in the deck should be shuffled and therefore be different for each game. In this case, the comparison would be that the deck is always in the same order, and so the first move to do a random number check (i.e.: draw a card from the deck) will always draw the same card, leading to the same outcome. In this case, the seed provided (the order of the deck) leads to moves below a certain accuracy threshold always missing if they are used first. Hopefully that made the claimed behavior (currently being investigated by other folks) a bit more understandable. The example isn't a perfect 1:1 with what's actually happening, but a deck of cards always being in the same order is pretty close.


mantiseye

Yeah I know how RNG works, I just wasn’t even thinking that they would forget to randomize the seed, which is fairly obvious. But also I was very tired when I posted that… still am tired, but I used to be too ;) I do have to say that it’s really funny their static seed always causes low probability stuff to happen on the first turn. Almost makes me wonder if it was a debug seed.


GolbatsEverywhere

> Yeah I know how RNG works, I just wasn’t even thinking that they would forget to randomize the seed, which is fairly obvious. Of course, _randomizing_ the seed of a pseudo-random number generator is impossible unless you _already_ have a working pseudo-random number generator. Generally it would get seeded with the current time plus entropy from button presses.


mantiseye

Yep, it’s me, using the wrong terminology again. Like I said, very tired. 😅


Lord-Trolldemort

If it's a RNG seeding issue it makes sense (big if). Though that means that every turn has a predetermined accuracy threshold where moves with a better accuracy will always hit and those with a worse will miss. We know the first accuracy check threshold is between 90 and 95, since frost breath always misses but icy wind hits. The second one has gotta be below 90, because frost breath always hits if it's the second move of the game.


mantiseye

Yeah if it’s just they forgot to seed the RNG (lol) then it makes sense but it would be easy enough to test (and pretty easy to fix). But man what an oversight lmao


BurlAroundMyBody

Oh my god it’s Pokémon Emerald all over again.


nicholth

I played a game earlier today, had a volt switch miss a Dragonite in the left slot on turn 1. Since it's 100% accurate, I assume the Dragonite had to have been holding a bright powder? Could this RNG seed make all T1 moves miss that slot if the Pokemon is holding bright powder?


Lord-Trolldemort

That’s actually hilarious. New meta: set up trick room without follow me or fake out support because they’ll assume that their fake out will hit you.


Lord-Trolldemort

It would be disastrous, and I have no idea. I have noticed that if someone outspeeds my Froslass and uses will-o-wisp it also misses, but that's only happened twice. It would also be a lot harder to notice if the RNG were being seeded in a way that usually results in a hit. If it's seeded with something team-specific or trainer specific, then maybe some people are hitting with their 90% accuracy moves every time but it would take hundreds of battles to notice that. That's why I hope someone rents my team, tries it out, and reports back


Despada_

I've been running Will-O-Wisp on my Ceruledge during my story playthrough, and I have to say that I don't think I've seen it hit when he's been the first to go. I've been counting on it being bad luck, but I'm starting to second guess if I've *ever* seen it hit whenever he's gone first at all.


Singularity3

Until then you can run Quick Claw to skip the first check


Magster211

That's bad. Really bad. This happens for other things too I've noticed, like heatwave missing left target the first time. I wonder if they'll ever fix it


CousinMabel

If heat wave always misses left target then Hatterene+Indeedee will have an even harder to stop turn 1 trick room since heat wave mons were a common way to deal with the follow me. Very cringe since Chi-yu+a 2nd spread move was my answer to this strat. This bug is actually such a massive TR buff in general since they go last turn 1, and now get a free dodge on any non 100% accurate moves.


Lord-Trolldemort

Easy, just go specs dark pulse on chi-yu to ohko Indeedee and get a slower Pokémon to cash in on the guaranteed hit to ohko Hatterene with the second move of the match! /s


Kentor1738

I thought I was going crazy. Every time my Tinkaton used play rough for the first time it always missed. Like so consistently I just came to expect it in my play through. Could just be a coincidence but I think you’re on to something.


PureGoldX58

Not the first time but far more than 10% of my play roughs have missed.


ant4457

The seed RNG is only messed up on online soloq battles, not singleplayer, raids or link battles.


maflarson

I started running fake out on my tinkaton because of the same reason


Kentor1738

Same actually


maflarson

I’m going to have to test it out in raids later tonight now


lucydaydream

Is it bugged for single player too? Because I had the exact same experience, play rough missed almost more than it landed


Fake-Chef

I feel like I’ve personally noticed this during my play through but I just thought I was unlucky


names_are_for_losers

Yeah I noticed this with Snarl, a lot of missing but it is supposed to be 95% accurate...


SlimDirtyDizzy

No it's not. Every source is saying it is only for link battles


volfur2251

It only effects battle stadium, it does not effect story, tera raids, link battles or anything other..


Jurboa

I thought the game was trolling me, for the whole playthru I was around 40% misses on tinkadonk


SlimDirtyDizzy

This bug is only for link battles. It doesn't affect solo gameplay


Maplethtowaway

Oh my god. I thought it was just me. I missed 3 play roughs in a row and got kod in the fighting star boss


Strausszz

yeah, me too, but with azumaril


DeviousEris

People are screaming that it’s in online only, but I question that. I wanted my Noivern’s Hurricane to hit more, so I googled how to improve accuracy - and found this Reddit topic. I signed up for an account just to relay that the RNG issue must be in single player too. I say this because I was missing every single Hurricane no matter when I used it - until I read this and starting using Air Slash right before it, now Hurricane lands after every Air Slash turn - every. Single. Time. And that’s in single player, not even dual battling. Idk what that means other than: thanks for the tip everyone. 🤣


Simplerdayz

So to shed some light on this, I had a very important fight to beat the game which solely relied on my Tinkaton getting a Terastallized Play Rough off as it's first move. I missed and had to soft reset the whole fucking battle twice. 3rd time, it went through. So no, it's not an issue in single player.


Simplerdayz

So to shed some light on this, I had a very important fight to beat the game which solely relied on my Tinkaton getting a Terastallized Play Rough off as it's first move. I missed and had to soft reset the whole fucking battle twice. 3rd time, it went through. So no, it's not an issue in single player.


anonymous_snorlax

New meta around finding efficient ways to miss first!!


ithilain

Blunder policy strats become meta


Hairy-Tonight5674

Literally bright power means free misses on t1 no?


Babymicrowavable

If this is the case, can anything be done about it?


Jams265775

Probably not, they never do patches or fixes unless it’s literally game breaking which hurts their bottom line. The only hope will be a fix in the DLC, but that is unlikely. This game is just so janky it’s criminal. Either GF needs to be stripped of the franchise or they need to hire 10x more employees and suck up having to pay people more money to actually make a quality product.


GrafEisen

This isn't accurate. There were a number of patches for Sword and Shield - see: [https://serebii.net/swordshield/patch.shtml](https://serebii.net/swordshield/patch.shtml) It's a matter of when and not if this will be fixed.


PK_RocknRoll

even if your comment was true, this IS game breaking lol


trickynibblesss

Ok I owe you an apology. I was wrong . 14 times in a row is waay too much . You’ve provided sufficient evidence and I agree with your claim and admit I was wrong .


Lord-Trolldemort

Oh, and if anyone wants to rent my team to see if the same thing happens to them the code is 424JCF


1Grazel

this game is an absolute mess lol


inchandywetrust

That would explain why my Tinkaton's Play Rough and my Ceruledge's Will-o-Wisp both kept missing far more than their 90 and 85 accuracies would suggest.


KingKurto_

holy this is nuts


CousinMabel

I was just about to make a thread on this! I noticed 90% accuracy moves were missing far too often, so I did some testing. I used super fang 200+ times and it ended up having about 60% accuracy. The first hit always missing would greatly effect this data though, so I will re-test with the first hit excluded which might explain things.


Wiitard

Split the data into all first hit, and all other hits.


Su_Impact

I posted it to the main sub but it's awaiting mod approval [https://www.reddit.com/r/pokemon/comments/z6721p/rip\_competitive\_pokemon\_rng\_manipulation\_ensures/](https://www.reddit.com/r/pokemon/comments/z6721p/rip_competitive_pokemon_rng_manipulation_ensures/) Let's hope this issue gets amplified so it gets fixed before ranked and/or GF delays ranked to fix it.


Resonance22

Hi u/Su_Impact, thank you for letting me know about your VGC bug report thread pending approval at r/Pokemon. I’ve gone ahead and approved it for you. :) There’s been a ton of traffic for S/V release and sometimes AutoModerator catches a false flag. I always dig around though in-case. We appreciate your patience and hope these bugs get fixed.


IzunaX

[There is definitely something](https://twitter.com/Sibuna_Switch/status/1596768465095983104) going on.


SuperParadox

Oh it's worse than that. There's NO change in the rng seed from battle to battle https://twitter.com/Sibuna_Switch/status/1596768465095983104?s=20&t=SplFuPEsiahpA3k5tSRJyA


The-Hostess

Saw others already tweeting about this and noticed it myself with tinkaton using play rough, good lord Nintendo lol


tuesdaysatmorts

That is an insane fuck up on Nintendo's part. Imagine all the other mishaps that are in the code that we aren't aware about...


Laskeese

You mean gamefreak, nintendo doesnt make pokemon.


AmbrosioMX

Nintendo got nothing to do with this


CTM3399

Does this happen in in-game battles as well? I'll have to test it out when I wake up. This is a really, really bad and legitimatly gamebreaking bug. Hopefully they can take action on this one soon or else the VGC ladder will be completely unplayable


jugol

only online, according to [this twitter thread](https://twitter.com/Sibuna_Switch/status/1596768465095983104) (from which I arrived to this post)


ttfan15

Wonder if this is why my Hydro Pump has been missing every single time.


MrLegilimens

Great work, OP. Sorry your frost breaths were the victim in this discovery.


Auxowave

Imagine this not being fixed before regionals 🤣


snow-days

I've noticed this with a Pokémon who has Hustle. Using the same rng for every battle would be absolutely disastrous.


Fleshy-Butthole

Could this just be an rng seed check thing regardless? Synchronize doesn't work in overworld either. Might it just be defaulting to check result that's predetermined instead of an actually random result?


HylianPikachu

By cartridge do you mean exclusively the physical cartridge games or digitally downloaded games on the Switch too?


Lord-Trolldemort

Digitally downloaded too. I just mean cartridge as opposed to showdown


HylianPikachu

That's what I figured but I saw a comment from someone saying that they digitally downloaded the game and didn't experience this issue.


Sh0esy

I knew I wasn't losing it, every time I used fury swipes (which was literally about 10 times) it missed. The first time I saw it hit was an opposing one like an hour or two in


LinkoPalinko

I’ve noticed something similar when it came to stone edge cause throughout my play through it never seemed to miss once


RaevynVexus

I’ve been running coalossal online and he’s always hit his first 2 stone edges but missed his 3rd. Now I know why.


CardsfromtheKaizer

This is interesting, was playing online and vs a friend yesterday, my twave on grimmsnarl missed so much I actually stopped running twave, assumed superstition and moved on. But now come to think of it, looking at my screenshots I missed a heatwave and 3x rockslides all on the left slot. I'm used to rng being rng, but it's never frustrated me like this before.


sc00ba_steve

My hypnosis on my gallade has been failing a bit too often. I just attributed it to rng but maybe not. I've often missed hypnosis 4x in a row more than once in the same battle.


Thezipper100

Oh no. That's *actually* a game breaking bug right there.


biggestboss_

I think the RNG seed issue affects a lot more than just this. If you save before catching a Pokemon, throw a pokeball and remember the result. Close the game and reload and try to catch the Pokemon again and the result will be exactly the same.


No-Calligrapher-718

I'm noticing something similar with catching Pokémon. Unless I catch on the first ball, every ball afterwards will fail until the wild Pokémon has knocked out my one. When I switch to my next mon, the next ball will catch. It may just be RNG, but the amount of times it has happened is uncanny.


Scathee

It's just RNG. Catch rates in this game are almost certainly changed (to be harder to catch Pokemon) since they added two mechanics that make it easier to catch mons (back attack and badge boost).


No-Calligrapher-718

Oh undoubtedly, it's just a funny coincidence that seems to be happening to me. I call it the "revenge capture"


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Scathee

Critical captures are more common now, as they have a much higher chance of occuring if you already have the Pokemon you're trying to catch.


Agahawe

"Missed a move? Just play better" but unironically


EtalusEtalus97

God damn it Sintendo.


Hysminai

Entirely anecdotal as I don’t have recordings but I felt like I’ve noticed this as well with my Torkoals heat wave. While obviously RNG can be RNG, it has felt like I’m missing WAY above average, in one case I missed 3 times consecutively on a sleeping enemy which was quite tilting.


TonesBalones

I just removed screech from my support because I missed 3 matches in a row.


BongosGalaxy

Holy shit


Alardiians

I always miss a first overheat it seems like. See! I told my wife I wasn't just being delusional! HA! Making her read this as I type it.


FullRyan

Is this a bug that just happens in online/link battles or has anyone noticed it affects all battles done on cartridge?


FioraDora

I just made a Maushold for some fun games in singles, and with a wide lense, Population Bomb should be 99% accurate every check. Yet it seems to miss quite often. Statistically possible but I lean towards some code being messed up than that many bad rolls


DremGabe

Ah hell naw


lookaslowpoke

Excellent detective work! I've personally noticed I kept missing and had no idea why...


final566

This is an AWFUL Bug but this will cause Nintendo to patch 100% because it is fatally game breaking for competition, 100% accuracy population bombs are so funny


ssBrother

I feel like I’ve been getting the same with play rough tbh


Neferens

I guess this could mean some moves would always crit if used in the beginning of a match? Scary stuff...


MCuri3

I didn't see the quirk you're describing, but what I did notice is that during my entire playthrough, Play Rough didn't miss once. I must have used it hundreds of times since I was using Dachsbun and opponents used Play Rough a lot as well. Not once did it miss. To the point I was convinced they buffed its accuracy to 100, but no, it's still 90. I mean it's possible but it really stood out to me.


Zzzzyxas

I find the amount of people saying they miss specifically hypnosis more than it should quite interesting. On the one hand, in game and raid seeds have been checked and they are indeed random. Also, hypnosis has a very bad accuracy, probably the only attack with such a low accuracy people would ever use. On the other hand, I have heard that from a LOT of people, and my experience is similar. And moves flinching 8 times in a row, was something I heard from several people before, and on this thread too. Could be nothing but it's a bit unusual.


MegaTorterra220

Idk if soneone alredy said this, but i have a suggestion. Let's study this rng. What hits and what misses. Let's create the best strategy to use this knowledge at our advantage in battle. And in case they don't fix this, let's flood the meta with this ideal team. Mirror match after mirror match until no one will want to play online anymore or they fix this issue.


Protoman89

Oh wow this is horrible


AyyyAlamo

Has this been patched yet....?


Lord-Trolldemort

Nope. I gave my trick room setter brightpowder last night and every single fake out and taunt missed


AyyyAlamo

Well hopefully they patch it by tomorrow....


Lord-Trolldemort

I’m pretty sure they are. They acknowledged a “balance issue” that came to their attention lmao


AyyyAlamo

Source? All I see in the update notes is references to performance issues


Lord-Trolldemort

https://www.reddit.com/r/VGC/comments/z989t6/series_1_ruleset_released/iyfhb7j/?utm_source=share&utm_medium=ios_app&utm_name=iossmf&context=3


Lyxs

Not sure if related, but during the Elite 4, absolutely 0 of my Avalanches have hit.


JamG22__

Did they fix this? Am I going mental? My play rough missed when it’s most needed, that has always been the way but missing ten times in a couple of games is just absurd luck. Is it still broken?


Lord-Trolldemort

It’s fixed


JamG22__

That’s good to hear at least, I thought I was going mad


SladeX7

How do you change the Wi-Fi battle arena?


Public_Ebony

Lol play rough on Meowscarada has 50% accuracy when used against stealth rock garchomp


Fath3rOfTh3Wolf

Iv heard from a few people that online battles have a fixed RNG seed and it can be manipulated to make ohko moves always connect. Wasnt sure how reliable that info was but iv been seeing this more and more and it seems like it is sadly true


Lord-Trolldemort

It was true before the ranked season started but they fixed it almost a month ago


fleker2

I've been playing digitally and haven't had any accuracy shenanigans. I wonder what differences might exist between the two types and whether it can be fixed.


GoodMorningBlissey

"Cartridge" in this case refers to playing on an actual copy of the game as opposed to an online simulator like Pokemon Showdown. From what I've seen and heard, this issue is also replicable on digital copies for online matches.


PureGoldX58

I'm hoping this isn't an error and that they removed rng weights much like how XCOM eventually did, making people think that something was broken but it was actually a true random. Edit: I meant something similar for NPC battles, not exactly that.


mantiseye

I am fairly certain pokemon doesn’t weight the RNG and the randomness is more or less “true”


minepose98

Pokemon was never rng weighted.


Zaso87

I’m going to laugh they did this on purpose to clean out you spammers to be done with the game for younger generations to learn and enjoy .


CardsfromtheKaizer

there's hot takes, and then whatever this is, what do you even mean? Any move that makes an accuracy check if it's the first move will miss 100% of the time, yeah that'll show those meta sheeple and teach the dad with 17 jobs and 92 kids how to play competitive! Now little timmy who can't fully read will be in the top 5 for VGC tournies this changes everything!


Zaso87

Shiny ✨ Pokémon are really common in play through as well


nejn111

That's not beacuse of broken rng that's because you encounter more Pokémon at the same time opposed to getting only 1 Mon per encounter in older games. Then it's obvious the shinys will be more common


Zaso87

Sure 😝


adamspecial

My talonflame had a unusually high percentage of flame body activations during my playthrough. I thought it was luck, but alas.


IndianaCrash

In online raid, for some reason my Nuzzle would miss 100% of the time, even without accuracy changes, on a non-ground type Pokémon


jtempletons

"Well I'm playing it and having fun" "well it's a step in the right direction" "well it's a design choice"


Rean4111

Does this happen on showdown doubles battle stadiums as well? Might explain some of my sleep RNG