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_Me_At_Work_

I've found the easiest strategy with randoms is to accept the craziness and make them rotate faster. It's quite the spectacle when both teams are on the same strategy (sadly 9/10 games for me) of running around in circles. The only way to beat it is to run around faster lol.


JD2Chill

Noooo. This is my friend's perspective too. Just turns it into a crapshoot.


Kick_Natherina

I said this same thing to my friend the other day and he said sometimes it works out better to just play with how the game is going. He is high level onyx and I’m only diamond 4, so I’m sure he knows more than me.


diabeetusboy

This is my experience in Onyx Solo queue. I can have all the map knowledge and strategy in the world, but if my team wants to murderball from A to C to A the whole game with no comms, I can’t opt to hold B by myself VS a team that knows how to play. It’s easier to just 4 stack with them or get picks from mid and capitalize on the chaos from my diamond shitter teammates


Mayhem370z

This also creates bad habits for when you actually have a full team.


eKon0my

This is the only way to play with randoms. Trying to micromanage them is just gonna turn into a bad experience for everyone involved. You just have to accept it and roll with it.


DarkShaigo

Yea that's true because you can't really control how your teammates perform or how randoms play so it's better to just accept it and let them play how they want and focus on yourself


martymcflown

Recently lost a game where our team was 232 and theirs 55, we lost because the opposing team decided to defend 2 caps at all times instead of rotating. Feels bad…


diabeetusboy

What a concept right?


teach49

So, what’s some examples of how to setup. I also get tired of running in circles but how the spawns work it often feels like the game kinda forces it. Like if I spawn C and it’s held by the enemy should I not cap it. Typical game, enemy takes B and also controls C, my team has A. I die, enemy pushes from B into A and I spawn C. Thus as I am respawning my team is capturing C. Repeat cycle between the 2 teams, how do you break the cycle.


ASidewaysBanana

It's situational, and to play it correct you need team mates that call out and play as a team. Ideally you always want to hold B, and a home flag of A or C, while keeping some pressure on their home flag, but not enough to forced their spawns onto your home flag. But people don't fucking get this, and don't use their mics or listen to call outs and fuck everything up. Live fire is an example I'll use - if your team holds A + B, and you spawn C after dying, then they're pressuring A enough to make you spawn out but not necessarily always in a position where they're capping or going to cap. Weather you should capture C or not is situational on if your team mates are able to slay them A. If you spawn up in that scenario and two of your team mates just died, you take C since they're going to take A, and rotate to fight for B.


angrygnome18d

That OR your team mates gave up A position to push up on C. Generally in Halo you spawn in "safe" areas which are influenced by where your team mates are and where the enemy team are. If you guys have A and B, but you are spawning C, this would mean either the enemy team has pushed up enough for A and B to no longer be considered "safe" OR that your team has pushed up on C far enough that the game now believes C is the "safest" place for you to spawn based on your team. This would also mean that the enemy team would likely spawn at A since it seems like B is usually a neutral position, so the game would consider it more "dangerous". You can effect this, however, by doing a few things. By understanding where the actual spawn locations are, you can influence where your team will spawn if you are 2 or 3 down. This is why when people run around, they split the spawn for everyone and everyone ends up doing worse, because there is no structure, only chaos. Ideally, on strongholds you'd like to hold two positions and if your team mates are dying, you'd ideally want to get to a position where you can influence the spawns enough to get your team to spawn near you. This is why positioning is so dam important in Halo, because you can win or lose the game based off of where you are such that you give your team either incredible spawns, or shitty spawns. Additionally, if you know the enemy team just got down 2-4 members, you can influence their spawn simply by standing in one area and blocking those spawns as well as tossing grenades or shooting at those spawns which will make the game think they are "dangerous" locations to spawn, and choose another area to spawn the enemy team. So, for example, if you guys have only A and the enemy team pushes and you manage to get them 4 down, you can force them to spawn at C by having your team move to B while one or two team mates throw nades and/or shoot at dummies.


Luke_oX

This is the the kind of advice I need.


angrygnome18d

Anytime man! Happy to help out. And thanks to u/ASidewaysBanana for sharing his/her knowledge as well. IMO the game is funner when we're all doing well and not frustrated!


AxeAndRod

In general, you should almost always cap a base that you just spawned at. After that though is where it gets multi-branched depending, mostly on where your teammates are after you have capped the stronghold. * If your teammates are dead and spawning after you, you should probably just slowly push out to another stronghold while they spawn. * If your teammates are trying to hold another stronghold, you should probably hang around at the stronghold you just capped while supporting them from afar if possible. **Be sure to block the spawns at your stronghold.** * If your teammates are pushing another stronghold, you should generally stay at the stronghold you just capped and defend it from the inevitable push from the other team. **It's very important to block the spawns at this stronghold for this case.** * If your team has already spawned and branching out on the map you should anchor at your stronghold you just capped while blocking spawns and then if your teammates get picks, you can then push out to another stronghold. If you do this, the enemy will almost always spawn behind you. IF you want a trip cap this is the method to get one usually. After they spawn behind you, you have to challenge them at the stronghold you were just at and win the challenge. **TLDR: to stop the ring around the rosy playstyle, stay at a stronghold your team owns and block the spawns for one spawn cycle of the enemy team before pushing out.**


teach49

Great advice, now I’ve played a good bit so I have a pretty good idea where the spawn points are. However, has anyone made a nice map of where they are exactly each map. Is that why when I watch pro games on live fire I often see people defending C sitting back behind the tower on the ramp? Are they blocking the spawns back there and forcing the enemy to spawn near camo? If you spawn camo and don’t hold C can you safely assume someone is in that neighborhood. Thanks for your insight


AxeAndRod

Yes, the most common spawn for someone at C on live fire is below and behind the tower. In fact, that spawn is so strong on that map that the enemy can even spawn there if you are literally in the C stronghold. That's why you see some pros stay on the back left of the tower to block those spawns. Alternatively, something I and some other pros like to do is to stay top tower and let them spawn behind the tower and then challenge them from above and behind with the element of surprise. In regards to this: >If you spawn camo and don’t hold C can you safely assume someone is in that neighborhood. Yes, this is probably the most important question you can ask and know in Halo. So, in answer to your question, yes it is likely someone was at/around C at the moment you spawned. They might not necessarily stay there, but they were there when you spawned. Also, when saying at/around C, that could also mean they were in somewhere like Nest and were looking at C or threw a grenade at C when you were spawning. Those are some things that can affect spawns.


teach49

Excellent man, I love digging into this


SynysterPC

I follow 2 courses of action and it simplifies the game a lot: if you spawn and you have 1 cap, you need to rotate and make a play to get a 2nd cap (unless you spawn and your teammates are already taking a second point, then you need to defend the point you spawned). If you spawn and have 2 points, rotate to the point your team is not defending currently. This often means wrapping back as teammates tend to group up on the 2nd point they are capturing. TLDR: 1 point capped, rotate and make a play on the enemies. 2 points capped, wrap back and defend the empty friendly point.


iCashMon3y

You just have to know your situation. Let's use streets as an example, if you spawn C and you guys are holding A/B take a look and see where your teammates are at, if you see that they are Arcade/B Street, you should probably hop C because most likely they are spawning cafe/back A. If you spawn C and you notice that your team is Front PD / Back A or pushing B street from A Side you should probably run past the point and help pinch b street from C side because the other team is most likely stuck B stairs,Arcade,Tires area. Also you should communicate to your team what you are doing even if nobody else on the team is communicating, they are most likely listening.


WaifSux

your team spawns C, you slowly engage and pick enemies off, take B, and hold power positions near B and C for the rest of the game


_mok

OPs point is that you wouldn't have spawned C if your team hadn't overextended. It's when you have A and B and your team just cant help but go for the flank/trip cap for no reason other than because they are bored that you spawning C will even happen. You will spawn furthest from the most enemies influence. Why are they all over A if not for the fact that your team overextended, and flipped the spawn influence? Why would you even be dead if your team held down A and B and were team shooting together? As other's have mentioned, when you have team mates you can't convince to hold two and not overextend, "if you can't beat them, join them". If you're holding A and B and your team is obsessed with pushing C, push with them, get the trip cap for a second or at least ensure you get C before you lose A, and then do the same thing again. It's an inferior strategy but it's better than you staying back at A while your team mates push C, and get you killed by spawners causing you to lose both C and A.


blunned

Repeat comment I’ve said previously - “…games we win are the ones where we set up to control two zones with sight lines. Over-rotating (if both teams are doing it) essentially just then becomes a slayer match with spawns dictating the end of the game (if slaying on both teams is equal). When one team is over-rotating and the other plays like you are supposed to, they will win 100% of the time with all else being equal. In these situations where my team doesn’t know what they are doing, I always try to explain briefly why what they are doing is hurting our chance of winning and that holding two zones is exponentially more important than trying to cap that third. If they don’t listen, I just start following them like a hawk and slaying while periodically staying back on a zone (or hiding behind it) when I think it’s safe to avoid spawn flipping - this is the only way I’ve found to win those games. If I try to play like you should during those games and the rest of the team is running around like chickens with their heads cut off, it ends up putting me in a lot of 1 v 2 or other bad scenarios. So it feels bad, but if they don’t listen the best option is to join them and even then it may still not work.”


kamSidd

This is why I prefer KOTH over Strongholds. At least in Matchmaking. Probably way different with a coordinated team or at least communicating teams.


dem0n0cracy

KOTH is nice, but how about Roaming King? It was my favorite special gamemode in Halo 5.


donutmonkeyman

I was real surprised with how much i enjoyed this in h5. The maps built for it were great though, im not sure if it worked well on dev maps


dem0n0cracy

It was on Plaza and worked great there


kamSidd

I mean that’s just a variant of koth though? I’m using koth as a catch all for all hill game types.


dem0n0cracy

yeah I'm just saying regular KOTH is a nade trap and annoying to play - roaming king is very dynamic and opens up so many interesting strategies.


DAD4GAME

Is Roaming King any different than Crazy King? I have never played Halo 5 and didn't get back into Halo until MCC came to PC. Matchmaking KOTH used to always be crazy king which is just KOTH, but the hill rotates between set locations at set times. I don't think I've ever played a KOTH game on Halo that just had a static hill


dem0n0cracy

Yes it moves continuously in a loop through the map.


DAD4GAME

Does the default KOTH in H5 have only one hill location? That seems bizarre to me


rjld333

Think you may be slightly misunderstanding the explanation. Roaming king was *literally* a moving hill. Like the hill itself would constantly and continuously move on a loop around the map. To cap/hold it you move with it moment to moment


DAD4GAME

Ohh, I got it now. I thought they meant that the hill moves like in 2/3/Reach/4. Roaming Hill sounds like a fun concept tbh


dem0n0cracy

Halo 5 never had a single hill KOTH. They added strongholds where you need 2/3 hills to score. Roaming king was based on a Doom mode called War path.


kamSidd

Isn’t crazy king random in terms of which location it goes to next? I thought mlg koth had a set order.


DAD4GAME

Yeah, you're right. Crazy king was the default matchmaking one for anything outside of MLG/hardcore from what I remember, but the MLG settings did have a set rotation. It's been so long since I've played a competitive KOTH match lol


kamSidd

Don’t remember roaming king in h5. Must’ve added after I stopped playing it. I’ve played COD’s version of it though. It’s interesting, not sure if would be a good competitive mode for halo though.


dem0n0cracy

Yeah no pros ever talked about it. It was a special mode added in 2018 or 19. It was in a rotational weekly playlist every 7 weeks or so.


Pebo_

Learning spawns is something that I think sperates ranks a lot. I don't have a clue about spawns and am probably flipping them constantly 😅 is there any good way of learning them and how to control them?


_mok

doesn't seem like any of those replying to you have explained how spawns work, so: **spawns are mostly based on enemy influence. The closer an enemy is, the more influence they have, the more enemies there are, the more influence they have. Meaning that you will spawn as far as possible from where the most enemy influence is.** Some things you can take away from this: \-If you and your team are clumped on one side of the map, killed enemies will spawn in the far corner on the other side of the map. \-if your team is clumped on one side of the map, but you are flanking solo on the other side, and they kill a few enemies, the enemies will spawn near you. \-anytime you spawn, you are spawning as far from the most possible enemies. Meaning you can deduce where most enemies are just based on where you spawn. (do be careful because one flanker could still be near you though) \-you can also mostly predict where you will spawn based on scrolling through cameras and scoreboard on your death screen. Seeing where your team mates are, whether they have any enemies in their POV, and checking the scoreboard for how many team mates or enemies are alive coupled with your newfound understanding of spawns can let you know where you will likely spawn. This is a key insight pro's use, and they actually make a habit of determining where they will spawn and what they plan to do off spawn while still on death screen. \-If you or your team are being very aggressive, and you flip the influence to the other side of the map, enemies will now spawn behind you. If you are going for the flank, and your team mates all push up to the middle of the map, enemies will spawn behind them (or on you if its CTF). Being hyper aggressive by yourself will often screw your team mates. If your team is being hyper aggressive and you are passive, it will screw you because the enemies will always spawn near you. aim to always been in line of sight of your team mates, unless you know exactly where all four enemy players are and are doing a coordinate pinch/flank with your team. Just having one guy running around by himself is not an effective strategy.


HumbleTFT

You’ll be able to pick up and learn about spawns more by just playing and watching high level Halo. Watching Pro scrims can help on learning to block spawns.


GeeDublin

I mean, at any given point in a game there's a maximum of 8 players total on the map - four of them being on your own team. Based on where you and your teammates are located currently, use the scoreboard to identify potential spots where enemies might be approaching + spawning. The reason I mention the scoreboard is because you can actively see who is dead and who is alive on the other team - which helps to make determinations on spawns and challenges. I always tell new people that the first thing I do when I spawn is to note where my team is first, then begin my movements based on that.


Zelltribal

But there’s always that one enemy that flanks you!


Billsimmons69

Best way to get an idea of spawn locations is just keeping track of your teammates. You really don’t need to know exact spawn locations (although that will certainly help you and you’ll pick it up as you become better), but being able to deduce roughly where enemies are spawning can be done strictly off of teammate placement. For example, on Live Fire, if you have one teammate C tower, one teammate tunnel, one teammate B flag, and one teammate on the wrap from B to A, you can more or less deduce their team will be spawning either on back A flag or in the yard near OS. You can do this with all maps. Keep a mental note of where you are spawning and just note where your teammates are at. When in spectate, rotate cams to see where your teammates are. Eventually you should be able to pick up where enemies will be spawning and it’ll help you cause you shouldn’t be getting shot in the back or caught off guard nearly as often.


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jonlmbs

Best way to win consistently is to hold B and one other either A/C. I usually just spend my strongholds games defending B and recapping one of A/C if needed. Applies to all maps except Recharge is better if you hold A/C. On Live Fire I will typically just sit Nest or back B and play defence once a two cap is setup.


allspoken

hey thanks. that's helpful. so if you're by yourself playing in matchmaking you kind of lead and hope people follow you? or do you call out empty bases?


jonlmbs

If I’m playing solo I try to mostly just defend B. I’ll push to cap with another teammate just by following them and picking up on their gameplay. Mic/ping to communicate helps a ton


allspoken

thanks!


CoachPeePeePooPoo

I think it has something to do with the rankings because you get points for capturing so people just go capture like crazy and don’t bother to hold anything


BenjaminGrimm09

That information I didn't know so you get more rank points for caps?


CoachPeePeePooPoo

Not 100% sure but player score is a factor and it’s the only reason I can think of for people to do it consistently every single game


johntsams

It doesn't matter that much if you win the game. Just have a high personal score. Especially if the other team is high rank and you'll profit. I've ranked up huge from losing 180 to 250.


a_persian

This is blatantly false. Objective play has very little bearing on your CSR. Unfortunately.


Nissanica

He’s not completely wrong though. Typically if you are first place on your team in score, it means you did everything decently well (including KD) and typically won’t lose a lot of rank for a loss. There are exceptions where maybe the team sucked so bad that you went 8-18 and still were first, in which case you may lose some rank, but i think thats rare.


a_persian

You can lose rank on a win where you have a 2.0 right now. It’s a total crapshoot.


Nissanica

Maybe like 1 point. Maybe. But that really doesn’t seem to happen to me.


Working_Bones

Winning is by far the most important factor for CSR gains. Next is kills per minute (high), then deaths per minute (low). Total score and objective points are way down the list. It makes far more sense to play the game intelligently and win than to play like a moron and lose but get a high score. You may be right that people are capping objectives for score because they THINK it'll help their rank, but it won't. It is also literally impossible to rank up on a loss, so you're full of shit there.


popje

I didn't knew that, so getting 20kills/30death is better than getting something like 12kills/8death ?


Working_Bones

The developers have said you want to maximize kills and minimize deaths (per minute). KPM is a more important factor than DPM, and they're both more important than objective points. So you generally still want a positive KD, but you also want high kills. 20-10 is definitely better than 6-0 despite it being a 2 KD vs 6 KD. For example. But 20-18 might be worse than 15-8. But then 20-18 might be better than 15-10. It's not clear where exactly the cutoff would be where like... that's enough kills but too many deaths. Surely there are some cases where fewer kills is better, if your deaths are sufficiently lower too. I just don't know how the algorithm decides when that is. For your example specifically, I'm not sure. I feel like 20-30 is probably worse than 12-8 but I could be wrong.


lionNacoma

Where has this data been explained at? I figured as much but would like clarification


Working_Bones

https://mobile.twitter.com/search?src=typed_query&q=Kills%20per%20minute%20(from%3Ajoshua_menke) Here are a bunch of search results from a former lead designer for Halo 5 who worked on the Trueskill 2 system.


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Working_Bones

Prove it. Developers say otherwise.


Billsimmons69

Unironically think this is one of the reasons. I’m D6 and hoping to push for Onyx this weekend and I’m still getting a bunch of teammates who are pressing for triple caps and constantly rotating to nearest flag. When I say “hey guys what if we just held map control with two flags” I almost always get some person with 25 captures saying I need to cap more to win the game and it’s mind blowing.


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Billsimmons69

True, but I think due to the difficulty in maintaining a trip cap in pubs, it’s barely ever worth it. Only way to maintain a trip cap for any set amount of time is if you’re just bodying the enemy and trashing them through slaying. Most times whoever goes for the trip cap simply flips spawns for one player and leads to a clusterfuck. The dude with 25 captures going -8 and whining about how no one else is capping flags is as annoying as the guy with 150 seconds of ball time and never ever drops the ball leading to 3v4. People in general need to be way more aware of the power of slaying the enemy. Too many focused purely on objectives.


AxeAndRod

Ironically, going for triple caps is the objectively better method of winning a strongholds game, but in practice holding two is better with limited communication.


CoachPeePeePooPoo

It’s crazy man, Every shooter has this game type I just don’t get it


Nerdygamer

Totally agree, but I have had times where I spawn near the enemy cap and usually that mean they are near our cap A/fighting my team at B and if I choose to go to B and help my team I risk them dieing before I get there and fighting a losing battle. Or I can try to defend A but I risk getting into a 1v2 so I generally just go to the nearest cap and take it. Now higher ranks I would attempt to hold or if I have a good team with mics I can communicate this, but 90% of the time my team has no mics and our A cap is going to be taken soon. SO far I've had success with this since as long as I can keep one or two caps up we win, but If I don't deiced to go to the nearest cap, when I respawn, then we usually get tripled and lose the momentum quick. Now if i'm alive I will make it my mission to defend our two and if my team goes full retard then I generally follow them as well, while watching the other cap without being to close and defend it but not committing fully to it since I need to play my life, because usually the other team is rotating as well and I don't want to get caught in a 1v2 or 3.


Green_Yonder

Player score has no impact on rank — unless there was some recent change. If so, would love to see a source on that. Edit: Love the downvoted from people who have no clue how the system works hah.


Nissanica

Oddball on recharge is so much worse imo. That map/gamemode combo is fucking impossible. I’ll take strongholds any day of the week.


diabeetusboy

Oddball on recharge exposes which team is better very quickly.


Nissanica

Feels like the whole match is just shooting people in the back from control while they chase obj in attic. Kinda dumb to me but to each their own.


diabeetusboy

I completely agree. My teammates will just bum rush attic one at a time, lose sword and give it to the enemy team, and then the whole round is chalked unless we’re lucky enough for the enemies to fuck up. The best results I’ve found are having teams that understand you need 4 up, or at least different angles to defend the ball. The second I see people start a 1v1 away from the objective I know we’re fucked.


Twitch152

I feel like this is a misconception of how to play strongholds. Now I will say I’m stating my opinion and that I am in no way a great player (Onyx mnk player if anyone must know). But in both halo 5 and infinite, I play strongholds exactly the way OP is saying not to, and here’s why. In my opinion, aggression tends to win more than passive play or defensive play. Let’s just use live fire as our example map as I feel this one confuses a lot of players. But if we think of A and C as corners, the team rushing the spawns and pinning their enemy in the corner has advantage, assuming it’s played fairly well. When you have B and your team pushes A to take a fight, one player ought to cap A and the rest need to rush out to angles that can pressure C as it’s being taken. You know where they’re going to be and where they can escape to, big intel advantage. Now, it doesn’t need to be an all-in fight, but it is the fight you should be taking, imo. If it doesn’t pan out you restabilize and decide where the next fight ought to take place. Let’s assume we run A to C like I mentioned, then win the C fight. You’d better believe I’m running back through top mid to take a fight at A and also keep an eye on B. When you’re doing this, you are FORCING MOVEMENT, which means you’re making the enemy do things they didn’t plan on and they will be forced to play into your game. That being said, I’ve played mostly with friends so our communication is better than solo queueing, but they aren’t good players, and this still works. I always tell them do not run back to a point to defend it, run to a position to fight them after they take it, then retake it and start the cycle over. If your team is in control of engagements then you’re in control of the game. That being said, retaking points when you don’t have two is a different story, but similar concept. In my opinion, you should never be making a play for B when you don’t have A or C. Even if I spawn B, I’m leaving as fast as possible and meeting up with teammates to try and take a home base. I prefer to go take the least contested home base, force them to spawn at the other, fight that and then take B when the enemy is spawning back at the opposite home base again. These moments of triple capping actually do add up to a considerable amount of points overall. And really, when it’s done super well, you CAN prevent the enemy from ever capping a single point, although this is extremely hard to do. I know it feels like a lot of running in circles, and it is, but it’s the strategy that has worked best for me thus far. Anytime I have played solo or duo and my teammate is losing their mind telling us to hold and defend two, I get absolutely crushed. Again, just my two cents, but I thought a little insight to the play style might be useful in some way. It’s not necessarily the right or wrong way to play, but it is viable.


iiBiscuit

Me former competitive player. Me blown away that you understand this gametype better than any other commenter so far. Playing defensively around your caps is not a dynamic enough mindset to take advantage of your map presence. You should be determining spawns and collapsing on their escape angles to break their flow while establishing map presence, exactly as you described. By doing this you occasionally manage triple caps while flipping the spawns and maintaining two points. Letting your points flip between AB and BC while collapsing from side to side is the best way to keep the other team off balance. It's not even coordination dependent, this is the best way to play solo too.


Twitch152

Good to get some validation that I’ve been thinking about this game type correctly. I was honestly starting to think I was the only one who approached it this way


BenjaminGrimm09

All of what you said doesn't apply to solo que because there's no communication or even pinging for that matter. You said yourself you play with friends and communication is just as important as gunny. I lean towards get 2 points hold them because 9 out of 10 times I'm the only one communicating and it simplifies the game for the players who aren't comming and saying when they are pushing or what they are doing. Running around constantly would be bearable if there are efficient trades and comms. But as I keep saying that just isn't happening. I don't want to run around and bait my teammates just to have great individual stats I want to win, as it stands for if I lose it takes 3 or 4 wins just to get those points back.


Twitch152

I know it doesn’t necessarily apply, I was commenting more to say that the play style itself isn’t wrong. And I know how the ranked struggle goes, I do wish you the best my man. The best advice I could give for ranked in general is don’t take it too seriously. I know it’s cliche, but building stress around playing ranked only makes it harder. Try new things, get a little crazy, and just always play to improve. And maybe MOST importantly, understand that you are bad. The guy or girl next to you is bad. Everyone is bad. But if you’re playing to learn, you will and you’ll get better, which can’t be said for everyone


BenjaminGrimm09

No I get bro, I'm diamond 6 on open and dropped from diamond 5 to 3 in solo because of constant stronghold matches I got last night and I just see a simple solution. Im all about team my kd hovers around a 1 but could careless as long as I'm in the right spots dealing damage, comming or getting trades. I'm not the best but far from the worst lol.


newzealander

Seems pretty crazy to pretend like you have all the answers when you're having trouble winning the game mode. Maybe your idea of what is the "correct" way to play is wrong? Don't expect to watch HCS and come out with the best strategy in matchmaking, they aren't the same game.


teeraaj

I had this discussion with my teammate last night. I said, “you know what the most frustrating thing about this game is? Having to quarterback an entire team on how to play strongholds”. Making sure people are working together to take back a site and break a set up, or not overextending when we have two sites already. It’s so hard to focus on your own gameplay when teammates are so clearly lost.


enailcoilhelp

lmao i swear way too many of you mfs seriously think "omg just hold 2 and trap them!!!!" as if it's actually that simple. Strongholds is far more dynamic than that, it isn't domination from COD, it's genuinely unrealistic to play that way in solo q. I mean have you seen pro strongholds gameplay? If it was that simple every strongholds would end like 250-15 lmao


bbstats

This approach only works if: a) You have a team who is more skilled (i.e. better KD) than the opposing team and b) Your team is not 'behind' (i.e. only holding 0 or 1 positions) and c) Your teammates are alive. What often happens is a - your team is weaker, b - your team is behind one, and c - your teammate just died but then spawns near an open unguarded position. But - I usually try to remind my team that secures are 'cheaper' than captures.


allspoken

>But - I usually try to remind my team that secures are 'cheaper' than captures. what do you mean by this? just grabbing undefended bases?


WaifSux

holding a base you already have is less costly than trying to capture a new base


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WaifSux

we've all been there hahaha


bbstats

I mean that tagging a base an enemy has begun to secure takes >1 second whereas a full capture takes a while (7 seconds?)


ItsMitchellCox

In my experience, the best strategy as an individual in most scenarios is to hold B and let A/C flip. Typically A and C are on opposite ends of the map so your team will spawn on one of the two sides and easily take it. If they flip, then it doesn't matter as long as YOU control B. If the other team takes A and C, it's hard to hold for an extended period of time, just stay on B and let your team eventually flip it back.


GeeDublin

You should avoid standardizing strategies like this because they're not applicable to all maps. For example, Recharge is a map where A, B, and C spawns are all just about equal distance to each other - with a slightly shorter route between A-C. This setup allows for an easy A-C cap, forcing the enemy team to spawn attic/orange pipes area around B flag. Holding A-C also allows your team to hold CR which is pivotal for controlling the open areas on that map.


ItsMitchellCox

That's a good point. It's why I wasn't absolute with my wording. Games are more dynamic and strategies should always be adaptive. I've found that this strategy works in most stronghold games. But I've also had games where carrousel capping worked to my benefit as long as my team continued to hold 2 points.


GeeDublin

Yep, no worries just wanted to make that distinction. I've had similar luck, specifically on Live Fire, where always rotating is the way to go. Especially if the other team has no strat other than to rotate constantly, as long as your team is aware and ready to rotate - you should skim points as you try to slay.


holeacher

I'm convinced solo/duo is busted. Actually playing solo is relentlessly painful, and it's all well and good people saying "slay" but when every other game is 70+ ping, or your teammates are on 70+ ping it becomes unplayable. I can team up with some right wrong uns on Team Ranked and be more than comfortable making kills and getting wins, solo/duo is a waste if time. The more you play the harder it gets as once you have a good game, you'll gey a sliver of progression.


Vitriolic-Crux

I’ve noticed this too and honestly I think it’s a halo player problem. Even at mid onyx people are lost, shit I even see pro scrims where people overstep the spawn lines and fuck up a hold. A map like recharge can be deadlocked if you hold shocksniper and never flip their spawns out of C


swenn64

I feel this on a spiritual level. can’t tell u how many times I’ve lost street stronghold because teammates run alley the final minutes of the game and just flip spawns and get picked off instead of going for B and getting a setup.


AADPS

>I'd rather play and map twice the size of behemoth than suffer any strongholds map. Do *not* give 343 ideas!


BenjaminGrimm09

Lol my bad


Brooks_SVP

I understand this, although I will say that many times I have the opposite experience where we have a prime opportunity for the trip cap with time to circle back and play for the enemies off their spawn and the rest of the team moves too slow. Everyone should do their best to make sure they're not playing either side wrong as much as they can.


Lumpyyyyy

Any time I try to explain this to my team, they just laugh or are super hostile. Like, I’m tired of spawning just to have them spawn behind me 15 seconds later.


Zelltribal

I’m always touching because while you’re on their zone it stops their score. Tbh I have no idea how to play it and I’m diamond 5. Had a game last night where our whole team was 3-15 + kda for the game and we lost to the other team who had all negatives except one. Honestly how should you win this mode? Because when I lose the other team is squading up the whole time and just overwhelming every zone they touch.


StockmanBaxter

I think the base problem is communication. And since most games lobby chat sucks or doesn't work during loading paired with the existence of Xbox Party Chat that will always be a problem. Me being on PC (sorry) allows me to be in discord and in game chat. Or in game chat and xbox party chat at the same time. People like being in their party chats. So most games people just aren't talking in game. Even if the whole team isn't in the chat. And the only solution might be what some random games used to do. And that is block you from doing matchmaking if you're in a party chat. But that won't stop people from just not using their mics.


Cranky_Grandpa

I think this issue is compounded with the awful ranked teammate logic. The higher onyx rank you earn the lower rank teammates you get. I wouldn't expect the diamond and lower crowd to know how to play strongholds more efficiently.


snoopyt7

it's ctf for me, nobody wants to push up into the enemy base


fastparrot

Just be the anchor that defends B while your team runs around like chickens.


SynysterPC

Guy started to trash talk me as he was 7-15 with 10 caps because I had 2 caps going 25-10. He literally sprinted around the map all game barely shooting. I get you want to be "obj" but it's so much easier to hold the map instead of sprinting off spawn every life.


Requarzium89

It’s insane the amount of times I see someone on my team with 15 captures who does exactly what you’re describing and then puts a message in team chat saying something along the lines of play the obj. Capturing as many zones as you can isn’t playing obj


findingstoicism

Aha yep- pretty straightforward game type but it’s shocking how difficult it is for people to make anything *but* the wrong play. I either accept the madness and just play to fly or hard anchor the big spots you absolutely don’t want to flip (tower, elevator, cafe). The game did a good job of making these spots heavily require blocking.


Themuttdog

Microsoft fucked this when they enabled party chat in the games. I would love to be in a fucked up loud lobby again. Also, you can just play a different gametype or quit.


betterAThalo

yea i just change it up. if we can hold a spot down i'll do that. if my team is insistent on constant pushes i'll help with that. whatever strategy we need


_mok

When you have team mates you can't convince to hold two and not overextend, "if you can't beat them, join them". If you're holding A and B and your team is obsessed with pushing C, push with them, get the trip cap for a second or at least ensure you get C before you lose A, and then do the same thing again. It's an inferior strategy but it's better than you staying back at A while your team mates push C, and get you killed by spawners causing you to lose both C and A.


SampleNumerous2161

When defending two points (let's say A and B) it's useful to have at least one team member on each point in an aggressive position. If the enemy collapses on one of your points (A), your aggressive team member should rotate and take the third point that the enemy left (C). Additionally if you take down 3 enemies while defending, those two aggressive players should take the third cap What's more frustrating to me is teammates that say "just hold 2!" When the correct move is to rotate


aimless_aimer

I literally don't know what the strategy is supposed to be for strongholds. I just go for the points and try to protect points as I see fit.


[deleted]

I was running into this a lot in solo/duo queue as well. Switched to crossplay and have had a much better experience, seems to be a lot more comms too. Playing at Onyx in both play lists and cross play has been a lot less stressful.


iMPoopi

I find this mode the most fun, and I don't mind running around in circles. You can sometimes win vs teams that outslay you with this strategy, by being clever about your rotations. In any case, you need to adapt to your teammates playstyle in Solo Q, and if you find that your teammates apply the "wrong" strategy or playstyle, chances are you will meet opponents that also apply the "wrong" strategy so it evens things out in the long run.


DarkShaigo

Yup it is quite annoying when you have teammates that have no idea what planet they're on the only real way to win it is if you play against a team that's even worse lol.


Trick0ut

Do you guys ever try communicating with your team, me and my duo partner have open mics in game even though we are in discord together (mute each other in game but everyone else can hear us). We make our calls and if we are playing an objective game we call out our strats. No every random person we team up with does not always work with us, but if we get A and C on recharge and we keep saying "dont push b, dont push b, spawn trap" i would say a good amount of the time our other two partners get the idea and play with us. Even if your team isnt talking to you, keep your com game strong with your partner, and keep your com's open for your team it will help i promise


24jl24

The game is set up to reward selfish players more than wins and losses…. Ppl play like selfish idiots bc they don’t care about winning they care about their score


ThatGuyMiles

Ah yes you’re one of those people… who only has mic to literally bitch all game, those are the best. Do you genuinely think you’re the ONLY person that knows how to play strongholds, Jesus Christ. You’re talking about a group of randoms in a MM system that rewards KD. You might be the moron here, just saying. I’ll admit that my judgment may be clouded here but I have literally the worst experience with people who want to be a traffic cop on the mic. They literally talk all game long but NEVER are they actually calling out any relevant information. It’s just one shot on my ex, or constant complaining about anything and everything. If you’re not going to call out RELEVANT information/player locations for god’s sake just turn your mic off already.