Welcome to /r/AmITheAsshole. Please view our [voting guide here](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_what.2019s_with_these_acronyms.3F_what_do_they_mean.3F), and remember to use **only one** judgement in your comment. OP has offered the following explanation for why they think they might be the asshole: > (1) I told my soon to be SIL that I will no longer be her Maid of Honor (2) maybe I overreacted but I was deeply hurt by her actions Help keep the sub engaging! #Don’t downvote assholes! Do upvote interesting posts! [Click Here For Our Rules](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/about/rules) and [Click Here For Our FAQ](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq) --- *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.* *Contest mode is 1.5 hours long on this post.*


YTA There are no legal implications for a MOH. Where the hell did you even get that idea? Maybe she asked your other sil just to be inclusive and not play favorites. Why can't you share the title? This is not YOUR wedding. Stop acting as if this is all about you.


She’s literally talking about that a marriage document has only two signature lines for witnesses


Witnesses are not the same as bridal party honor titles. You can literally have 5 moh and 5 best men if you want. They just obviously wouldn't all sign the certificate.


That's what my best friend and his fiance did. Everyone in both parties were Maids of Honor and Best Men. It's not against the law lol. OP is just very desperately trying to convince everyone that she's not in the wrong.


Love that idea. OP is pissed because she planned a wedding that didn't happen and it all got changed. She somehow thinks she's entitled to dictate everything and is just making up nonsense. What a sense of importance and entitlement!


OR… She feels taken advantage of and like they gave get the title to make her do the work while the other MoH isn’t doing any of that… Which is exactly how this reads.


Or she took over so much that the bride and groom changed the plan.




My brother and sister in law had 10 bridesmaids/groomsmen and they had my mom and her dad sign as witnesses.


Witness is not the same thing as maid of honour. It might be that the maid of honour and best man are most often the people asked to be witnesses, but it's not mandatory.


She cannot share because its tots obvs illegal to do so... /s


In Germany you can legally only have one maid of honor. And the groom can only have one best man. There was a time when they also had to sign the document. That's not the case anymore. But they're still mentioned in the document.


That's not true. The wedding party can be what the couple wants. Maid of honor and best man are honorific titles, not legal titles. It does not matter who signs as witnesses. Anyone can be the legal witnesses.


Not in Germany, Here you are only allowed two witnesses, the "Trauzeuge" and the "Trauzeugin". The translation for those words would be " best man" and "maid of honour", so I can understand that there might be a problem in different understandings of the words. And they do have an legal function for the wedding, as they are witnessing it. Even though the law isn't as strict anymore, i.e., you don't need them, but can still have them, for the civil part of the wedding, you do need them if you want to get married at certain institutions, like the catholic church. Next to the witnesses you can of course have other people in your wedding party, if you wish. The tasks of the Trauzeugen are (slightly) different to the tasks of maid of honours/best man in the US/ other parts of the world I guess.


Thanks for clearing up some things that us Americans wouldn't be privy to. That helps a lot, and I learned something today so that's a bonus. With this discrepancy cleared up, I think it requires a bit more context. When OP says that they instead wanted a small "civil ceremony," does that mean that the traditional legal roles would be required? The other thing OP would need to clarify then is did her brother and his fiancé opt to do something less traditional? If so, did OP give pushback because she was planning their wedding, and what was their given reason for wanting a different style of wedding from what OP was planning?


Sweetheart, that does not change the fact of being able to have as many bridesmaids and maids of honors as you want. Those are not legal titles. Legal witnesses are a different subject. Many countries require 2 witnesses who are present for the ceremony. Mine does, too.


Sweetheart, you’re in the US, OP is not. Fun fact, not all countries follow the same laws or traditions as the US.


***sWEethEaRt*** if they choose to have a Trauzeugin then they do have some amount of legal responsibility above and beyond simply being a witness.


I don't see how that changes anything if that is the situation, which we don't know since OP hasn't confirmed it.


Of course you are able to have as many bridemaids as you want, but you can only have one Trauzeugin




So you can be gay married in Germany but you have to go find one man and one woman to file for marriage? That doesn’t sound accurate tbh


It’s not. But OP shouldn’t be calling them “MoH” and best man. You need to have witnesses - two - when you get married and they sign the wedding certificate. This is also the case in Sweden and Poland for instance. So yeah, OP is telling the truth. Legally, the bride can only have one witness.


It's the same here in the US, too. The point is that the maids of honor and best man don't have to be the signed witnesses. My witnesses were my mom and father in law as the best man was drunk and the MOH was in the restroom when it came time to sign the license. I can't imagine the German government giving a damn what you call your bridal party on the day.


I think we're dealing with a bit of a translation error here. SIL wants two MOH in the more American sense of being the two most important people to her while OP is hung up on the traditional legal aspect of it when it doesn't look as if SIL has even thought of that part being especially important to her and not a snub at OP. Bad communication.


Our parents were, I guess, overcome with the ceremony that they couldn’t handle being witnesses(?). So our photographers were. We didn’t have MOH/BM though.


This sounds like bullshit. [I found this saying that witnesses are not required in civil ceremonies in Germany](https://www.howtogermany.com/pages/marriage.html). Care to explain, OP?


When OP says "maid of honor" she probably means the German "Trauzeugin" - which is kind of the next best translation but isn't really accurate because this whole "bridal party" thing normally isn't practiced in Germany. We typically don't have bridesmaids and stuff, but brides and grooms often choose a Trauzeuge each (though bridal parties probably get more common these days, thanks to the influence of American pop culture and rom coms). Anyway, you don't legally need a Trauzeugin to witness your marriage, but if you wish, you can have them and sign your marriage certificate (and in that case, here OP is correct, there may only be two per marriage, though it's gender unrelated). If you want a Catholic church wedding, two Trauzeugen are mandatory. So, unlike maid of honor, Trauzeugin isn't an entirely honorary title (but still, formally, a meaningless one because you don't need one).


That doesn’t mean you can only have one MoH, it just means that only one can be the legal witness. Whatever you want to call people in your wedding party is entirely up to you and not legally dictated.




EHM.. NO. I got married in 2019 and my BIL and one of my best friends were our witnesses. We had "wedding parties" but NOBODY's name appears on the document in that regard.......


INFO: What does this mean "legally that's not even possible where I live."


She’s talking about the number of witnesses on the marriage document lol


Which, if that's the case, makes this statement by OP even more hilarious because the law doesn't specify who those witnesses need to be. It's just customary that it's the best man and maid of honor. You could literally have Uncle Joe and Aunt Sue come in and be witnesses.


Oh 100% you can have two folks from the band do it, at least in Canada. I know because I thought there was a good chance my moh and bm would not make it to my destination wedding lol the only person it’s not supposed to be is a parent


I think in the US it can be a parent.


I got married in the Bahamas and our dads signed so there are some countries where that's fine.


I’m not sure they would have stopped us from using a parent, but we had already asked the band if they’d be ok with it and they said yeah. The party did end up showing up so it didn’t work out that way, but it would have been cool if it had.


That's hilarious. I love that for you guys.


After having spent a few years working weddings, every single other vendor I knew either made a wedding they could use to promote their business in or eloped/had tiny destination weddings. We had 7 guests (4 parents, the couple that introduced us and their young daughter - who were nervous travelers, hence the back up plan) far away from home and then a local, larger reception about a month later. Absolutely cannot recommend it enough. It was genuinely so easy and fun.


I got married in the US and our kids were our witnesses.


If your kids were 18+, then yeah.


I think in some places minors can sign as witnesses as long as there are also adult witnesses.


Just officiated a wedding in California, there are no age restrictions on witnesses, they just have to be able to sign their name and understand they’re witnessing a marriage.


There are 5 US states where your dog can be a witness (or really any dog).


I ended up getting married at the courthouse on new year's eve for tax reasons (real aka fake wedding happened in early January. Tax difference paid for the caterer). My maid of honor and her boyfriend signed as witnesses as the best man lived in another state and wasn't in town yet. They were running a little late and we lined up another NYE couple that we meet while waiting as back up witnesses. Witnesses do not need to be in the wedding party at all.


Lol, I got married at the court house and we didn’t have witnesses so two strangers who were in line behind us did it. 😂


In some countries you need at least two witnesses to the nuptials to co-sign the wedding documents with the bride and groom. This task usually goes to the best man and MOH. Sometimes those will be the only two members of the wedding party.


YTA - It's her wedding. She can have as many or as few Maids of Honor as she wants. This isn't about you, it's about them. Everyone in the groom's party at my best friend's wedding was a "best man" because that's what he wanted, and none of us complained. I feel like you're trying to manipulate the post in your favor when you frame things like, "They canceled the wedding when they realized it'll cost money." Like, no duh it's gonna cost money. You saying it this way makes it sound like your brother and fiance are entitled brats, which is what I think you're trying to go for. What I believe is actually happening is that they canceled the fancy wedding you were planning because it cost *too much* money, and now you feel slighted over that and are taking out your aggression over this MoH thing. Should they have communicated to you that there'd be more than one before? Sure. However, you need to grow up about this and realize that it's not all about you. >She said that she wanted us both to be MoH, but legally that's not even possible where I live. I had no idea there were laws against this. Mind telling us what the law is? I only ask because I know it doesn't exist, and you're just clearly trying to throw every single excuse at the wall to make yourself look like less of an asshole.


Wow. No. Bride made her plan everything and then went behind her back and got a 2nd MoH w/o telling her. If it was normal, then she would have said something to OP, but she just wanted OP to plan everything b/c she knew OP would either not plan everything or ask for help. The bride used OP. Also - you are looking at American traditions and rules and traditions from other cultures don't necessarily translate 100% to English. So, although technically they can have 2 american style MoH - the German term for the role is also tied to being a legal witness to the wedding and legally there is only one for the bride.


I agree with this take 100%


Since when does the maid of honor plan the wedding? Did they ask you to book venues and rent chairs or did you just decide to do all that on your own?


They asked me to.


I get the sense this is the major pain point here. This other person gets to share the title but hasn’t helped in the planning. That sucks. Sounds like they may have taken advantage of your helpfulnesses, whether intentional or not, not sure; but I’ve never heard of MOH duties including planning the entire wedding.


ESH. It was a bit of a jerk move on your SIL's part to ask you to plan something only to end up cancelling. **But** she is allowed to have more than one MOH and your reaction seems a bit extreme. Also I cannot find anything online that states that you legally can't have more than one MOH in Spain.


Except I'm not in Spain 😅


Must've misread. But do tell us where it's illegal to have more than one MoH?


It's not. OP is just trying to win reddit to her side by making the other party look guilty.


I think OP is talking about the two witnesses that "testify" the wedding... there can only be two. If the groom chose 1 and the bride chose 2, OP is assuming that she will be left out. In my country we don't call it MOH - I think that this is what's confusing everyone assuming it's in the US and that the manes are the same. That being said... ESH OP for making the wedding about her and the bride for not being honest from the beginning and letting one MOH do all the work.


I googled and all I could find was articles from several different countries about how it’s easier and better (less work on one person) to have two.


You sound exhausting.


Info: what do you mean "legally" it's impossible to have more than one MOH? Where would this even show up officially?


It shows up in the documents they have to sign :x


That just means one person signs. It doesn't mean she can't you have you both in the ceremony as a maid of honor.


Anyone can be sign as a witness. It’s not necessarily the attendants.


Correct. I was a witness for my brothers wedding but I was not in the wedding party.


As MOH or as witness? I've never heard of that, since having an MOH isn't required where I am in the first place.


Actually it’s two witnesses not one


Depends on the state.


You must be one of those Americans who believe everyone on the internet lives in the US.


That’s a WITNESS, not a MOH. Ffs


She had two people she cared about that she didn't want to disappoint. I don't think this was done maliciously.....I take your point about the papers being signed, but there is probably a way to share the other duties....


Is it normal for a moh to book things for a couple in your culture because that’s very not normal to me. Who cares how many bridesmaids and maids of honor there are? Or if they delay their wedding until after the holidays? It sounds like you’re finding reasons to bail when you just don’t want to celebrate their union (not even acknowledging she’s his fiancé). Just bow out if you want to. Yta for making this about you


They asked me to. As I have more experience with these things.


But not enough experience to realize that she can have a non traditional wedding party and it’s not a personal attack?


It's not about the party. But about the ceremony at city Hall. The one where they have to sign the document that makes them husband and wife.


Your logic here doesn’t make sense to me at all. You’re upset that another SIL might sign their documents but so upset that you just may not participate in their wedding at all? That sounds so petty to me. Two people have to sign, yes, but you can’t tell them who signs anyway. It’s not really your business. And importantly, they never said you couldn’t be the one to sign. They just gave two people moh in the ceremony.


Can you both still be there? Why do you both have to sign you can’t still be it and not sign the paperwork


Ok, but it's still *her* wedding, and a good planner would know to try and do the thing that the bride wants for her wedding. If she wants two maids of honor, then that's ok. If she wants to have a non-traditional wedding without you as the planner, then that's ok. If she wants to delay the ceremony until later, so be it. You're coming off as whiny for not getting what you wanted. I bet you were fantasizing for months on people coming to you on the day of your brother's wedding congratulating you for putting on such a fantastic wedding. And having to share the MoH spotlight with another person probably has you seething that you're getting even less attention now.


I think you are overreacting.


Legal? Maid of honor? What?


If you’re doing someone a favor, and then they decide they don’t need the favor after all, and you feel angry, YTA. You made some calls and they realized their budget wasn’t going to allow for what you were planning, and you feel…cheated? YTA


ESH. What do you mean not allowed legally? The bride should have told you about having two MOHs but you seem to be overreacting about her decision. It's her wedding she can have 10 MOHs if she wants. Did she explicitly ask you to book all the things you mentioned? It's a very strange thing for the bride and groom to not be involved in the main wedding planning and delegate it to the MOH


I’d love to hear the legal statute about how two MOHs is illegal. Yta


Lol ‘legally’ YTA


YTA, stop being a drama queen


Info- where did you hear having two moh was illegal?


You aren't actually 25 are you? This reads like a 15 year old wrote it.


YTA sweetie... The law doesn't dictate the non-bride or non-groom titles/roles of a bridal party. You can have 2 MoHs, 0 MoHs, 5 Best Men, etc. So, yes, you and your other SIL can share the title. I was 1 of 2 MoHs in my best friend's wedding because her childhood bestie was not married yet, and neither was I (her college bestie). You probably need to fix this ASAP...... 😕


Beyond your argument about having two MOH’s being legal (which sounds like in Germany the only issue is who would be the one to sign the document, NOT that there is a law saying “only one person may be titled the Maid of Honor in a wedding party”), YTA for your reaction. A bride can have whomever she chooses to be a MOH and just because she has two doesn’t mean you are second choice. I had two MOH’s because my two best friends were both equally important to me. Neither were a “second choice.” Maybe the bride could have mentioned it to you earlier, but it doesn’t make her the AH. Rather, you’re the AH for making it all about yourself.


Yta honey... go to your soon to be SIL and apologize and ask to be moh again!!! You are going v to ruin your relationship with both SILs and possibly the rest of the family. You're wrong.


Any legal responsibility of a MoH (if there are any at all) will just be a formality no one would notice, you can have 2. She absolutely should have told you she was asking someone else too. I think you're overreacting and would regret pulling out after it has all calmed down a bit. ESH


This person might be in your life forever. You appear to go out of your way to help people, but just step back and be in the wedding party. Clearly, they didn’t understand the costs of a wedding and you brought that home for them. You saved them a lot of issues this early on before it got scary expensive for them. You might have saved their marriage if you see all of the stress posts about marriage on here. Just say, “wedding planning is a lot of work, but I’ll step back and be a regular bridesmaid at this point”. It’s a lot safer and might keep the peace even though you were disrespected. Also, consider being a wedding planner, you have a skill and it’s impressive.


YTA. This is extremely petty, OP. People are allowed to change their minds. Ask to be on the marriage certificate as compensation for your work on the canceled ceremony, then suck it up. You're making everything about you right now and that's not right. It's THEIR wedding.


YTA I sympathise with putting work into wedding planning provided that actually asked you (some of yeti wording sounds fishy) but for blowing up when you realised you were co-MOH. Also, 'legally' the bride could have as many MOH as she likes, noMOH or decide to call her wedding party goddesses or flower beasties instead of bridesmaids if she wishes (would just have to explain if anyone asked).


Legally? MoH? Is that a legal position? Sorry, while bride sounds like an AH, that doesn’t mean you’re not. YTA


I mean…you are basically angry because your SIL might put her signature on a piece of paper instead of you? Did I get that right? It all just sounds very dramatic and petty. YTA and perhaps its a good thing you remove yourself from this wedding.


lEgAlLy what does this even mean? YTA


This reads as though it was written by someone who is much younger than they pretend to be, who knows nothing about engagements or weddings AT ALL


YTA. Pretty sure it isn’t illegal to have two maids of honors in your wedding. You sound ridiculous


^^^^AUTOMOD ***Thanks for posting! This comment is a copy of your post so readers can see the original text if your post is edited or removed. This comment is NOT accusing you of copying anything. Read [this](https://www.reddit.com/r/AmItheAsshole/wiki/faq#wiki_post_deletion) before [contacting the mod team](https://www.reddit.com/message/compose?to=%2Fr%2FAmItheAsshole)*** So for context: I (F25) have two older brothers. Both have girlfriends and one is about to get married at the end of the month. They got engaged 4 month ago and I planned the whole engagement. Not surprising then that I got asked to be the maid of honor. They told me to plan their wedding for July next year and that's what I did. I booked a fotographer and DJ, I even found a good venue and already found a website where you can rent chairs and tables. Fast forward 3 weeks and out of the blue their telling me that the wedding is cancelled as they suddenly realised that it's gonna cost money. So all the work I'd already put in was for nothing. But they said that they still wanna get married this year. So it'll be just a small civil marriage. Then, 2 days ago, we threw a bachelorette party for her. We all got sashes with "bridesmaid" or in my case "maid of honor" on them. All was good until I saw, that my other SIL also got one saying "Maid of Honor". Well, save to day that I was confused and thought that it was an honest mistake. Turns out, the soon to be bride went behind my back and asked her to be maid of honor "too". Without telling me obviously. So I just told her that I'm not gonna be her second choice. If she'd wanted another MOH she should've said so instead of going behind my back. This way it was like stabbing me in the back. She said that she wanted us both to be MoH, but legally that's not even possible where I live. So am I the asshole? *I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please [contact the moderators of this subreddit](/message/compose/?to=/r/AmItheAsshole) if you have any questions or concerns.*


Everyone needs to grow up.


Probably not the popular opinion, but I am saying NTA. But if you back out of the wedding party completely you will be. Please do consider very carefully how you act here though. I am basing NTA on 2 things. All the work you put into the 1st wedding and them canceling AND her not informing you that there will be more than 1 MOH. They should not have had you do anything for the wedding until they knew what they were wanting to spend. Now if you did that work unasked, then that is on you and can't be upset about it. The main thing is that she never told you that you would not be the only MOH. I agree that they can have whatever wedding they like. It is most common to have one MOH. She should have told you before you discovered it on your own. Especially if she knew the extra work you had put into it. But how you act now can affect your relationship with them for a very long time, if not forever. I don't think you should back out of the wedding party. I think you will regret it. Honestly, I think you should just suck it up and stay a duo MOH. It may feel like a big deal now, but as time goes on, you will see there are more important things to you in life and this won't feel like such a big deal. But if you really don't want to stay a MOH, let them know (after some time has passed), that you don't think you will be able to commit the amount of time needed for a MOH, but would still love to be in the wedding party.




Info: are you on the hook for the reservations?


ESH What do you mean they didn't know it was going to cost money? Didn't they have to put deposits down for the vendors??


NTA you did a lot of work for nothing


Haha fotographer 🤣


NAH yeah she’s being shitty but what are you actually losing here? Just move on and maybe don’t consider her a close friend