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WilliamWyattD

This is what happens when people talk in absolutes. Of course female status, education, class, income etc. has an impact on men. And men further prioritize these things when explicitly looking for an LTR, and even more for marriage. Men just do it to a far lesser extent than women do. However, HVM have so many options that it is easy enough to make sure they get a woman of sufficient hotness while also getting these more peripheral requirements checked off. But imagine if no smart, educated, intelligent or classy women had an appearance greater than a 7. Rich guys would be at McD's drive throughs all day long.


LetsDelveIntoIt1

Voice of almost-reason :) Men would make a beeline for the 10/10 McD's women in a black-or-white world the same as women will make a beeline for the richest-man-on-planet-short-bald-ugly-guy. Both extremes are true but the overwhelming majority of the world lives in the in-between. The male CEO may go for a 7/10 female junior professional (and vice versa), but the CEO isn't going for the 10/10 female janitor.


FlamingZebraFace

There's no such thing as a 10/10 janitor


jayval90

Kind of true. Generally a 10/10 person would hold such jobs as beneath them, so would rather be jobless than be a janitor.


Available-Ad-9338

10/10 is like Henry Cavill or Gisele Bundchen. Hotties don't have to work shitty jobs, they can easily marry up or get better jobs on their looks alone. I've never seen a supermodel-tier person work a shitty job. Most janitors are ugly/fat/old.


FlamingZebraFace

Yep


jordan_form

if you look at supermodels, no makeup, without good lighting, they are pretty "normal" looking. they're still hot, but you get a better understanding that they are not significantly hotter than the hottest cashiers. if you really had a book of all the female cashiers in the world, and you could select the hottest, they would be hotter than many supermodels. actors and models get their makeup done by professionals. they have professional trainers, professionals are plucking their brows and many are going to a plastic surgeon to remove that little extra fat here and there. if the hottest accountants did all that, they would be at the same level. just look at all those actors without makeup photographs. >I've never seen a supermodel-tier person work a shitty job. go to LA. some future supermodels are working shit jobs right now.


Available-Ad-9338

> if you really had a book of all the female cashiers in the world, and you could select the hottest, they would be hotter than many supermodels. sounds like bullshit, models are selected for their beauty while cashiers aren't. the average model without makeup/surgery is still going to be more attractive than the average cashier. > if you look at supermodels, no makeup, without good lighting, they are pretty "normal" looking. they're still hot, but you get a better understanding that they are not significantly hotter than the hottest cashiers. actors and models get their makeup done by professionals. they have professional trainers, professionals are plucking their brows and many are going to a plastic surgeon to remove that little extra fat here and there. if the hottest accountants did all that, they would be at the same level. Most models are tall, lean and slender with strong sharp cheekbones/jaws and nice facial ratios. That's genetic. Gisele Bundchen, Adriana Lima, Alessandria Ambrosio and Monica Bellucci were and still are beautiful without makeup/surgery. Of course most models get beauty treatments throughout their careers but they had a good foundation to begin with. Most women won't turn into Monica Bellucci just with makeup, gym and liposuction because they don't have her fine bone structure. > just look at all those actors without makeup photographs. Most actors are still above average without makeup. Very few actors are ugly unless they play comedic/dramatic roles like Jack Black or Jason Alexander. > go to LA. some future supermodels are working shit jobs right now. Most supermodels start modeling in their teens. Agencies generally don't want 20+ yo models. If you're older and still not modeling, you're probably never going to get into the industry.


jordan_form

>they had a good foundation to begin with. certainly. but look at gisele no makeup vs gisele in a magazine advertisement. maybe these supermodels are still a 10 for most people, but they become "realer" in that you can see their flaws more in a "real" setting. you never see "ad gisele" in real life because that's impossible to do. you can't walk around with professional lighting all the time. i'm talking about the difference between a "real" human vs a "photo shoot" human. THAT is all the stuff (lighting, makeup, surgery) that can get you from a "real" 8 to a "photoshoot" 10. here's what i said: >if you really had a book of all the female cashiers in the world, and you could select the hottest, they would be hotter than many supermodels. you misunderstand. you can select hot cashiers because there are MILLIONS of them around the world. statistically, some of them will be hot. we're talking about the hottest cashiers. not the AVERAGE. >If you're older and still not modeling, you're probably never going to get into the industry. they are pretty young. you hear them in interviews. "What was your worst job?" and sometimes they reply with something like "I worked at a McDonald's once when I moved to L.A. at age 19."


_Helicopter

Yes because mostly richer people are more good looking. Richer people are also more educated. Most hotties are in middle class - upper middle class.


Globbi

Note that intelligence and earnings are correlated with beauty. Obviously it's hard to know where's the causation there and also there are plenty of examples of wealthy but ugly outliers as well as pretty and poor or dumb. 10/10 fast food or janitor worker will likely only be there temporarily. If it's really 10/10 they may get scouted to be a model. But normally they have good chance getting better job after applying just from halo effect. It's not even conscious sexism of someone hiring hot chick for office job because he likes looking at hot chicks (though obviously also possible). Person hiring or promoting will look at candidates and has to choose, they will think that this pretty person is probably also more competent. Then you have generational effects. Wealthy people have more time and resources to care about their health and looks as well as education.


omegajelly200

Do keep in mind that employers like to purposefully hire pretty women for jobs that require face to face interactions, knowing that they in turn will attract hungry simp male workers who won't quit and go work in different companies. Yes, there are still men out there who believe in shitting at where they are eating, plenty of them in fact. Also, lookism among female employees are also driven in part by affirmative action hiring. If you got only a few spots for token hires, why not hire the prettier ones, right? The prettier ones aren't going to do any serious work, and they make for simp magnets keeping the males in line.


ChibsFilipTelfordd

Correlated yes strongly no. Iirc it's like r=0.3


[deleted]

Yea that correlation has to be weak as fuck. I have seen way too many dumb poor hotties and rich ugly CEOs to take that serious.


tryingtolearnstuff1

Only because generally the janitor would have less in common personality wise. If its between a minimum wage bookshop worker who's passionate about books, and a high flying lawyer or doctor making 7 figures I think most guys wouldn't have a preference


DjangoUBlackBastard

Also a 10/10 woman isn't working at McDonalds. Why would they? I know some very stupid 10/10s and they get modeling offers constantly. Just walking down the street a talent agent will pull them to the side and I don't live in NY or LA.


WilliamWyattD

I actually think the CEO is gonna pick the 10/10 Janitor at least as often as the 7/10 professional maybe at least as often. Maybe more.


DesperateTraffic3164

No shot in hell.


xQueen-Bx

"pick" for whaT? sex? sure. to be the mother of his children, recipient of his status via marriage and introduce to and make a member of his family? absolutely not


DjangoUBlackBastard

It's all a trick question anyway because no 10/10 woman is working at McDonalds. If she's that stupid and unskilled she can literally earn more money just being pretty and showing up at parties or being a waitress. If you're a 9-10/10 woman the world is your oyster.


LetsDelveIntoIt1

Most certainly not. This is where HVM distinguish themselves from the LVM - they’re not so animalistic as to be ruled by their base desires only, and value intelligence, education, commonalities, class, etc.


idrinkapplejuice42

This sub is autistic I swear.


xennope

Reddit is autistic.


[deleted]

HVM don't eat McDonald's. The hot women will get hired at places that HVM do frequent.


omegajelly200

Smart, educated, intelligent and classy women also do yoga, rock climbing, horse riding, ballroom dancing, basically all sorts of physical activities that require serious time and money investment, but also guarantee that they are going to get hot bodies if they are dedicated to their hobbies.


DesperateTraffic3164

>However, HVM have so many options that it is easy enough to make sure they get a woman of sufficient hotness while also getting these more peripheral requirements checked off. This is correct. >But imagine if no smart, educated, intelligent or classy women had an appearance greater than a 7. Rich guys would be at McD's drive throughs all day long. Of course. Being attractive is the minimum entry requirements.


Dagenius1

Ok..I’ll regret this but I feel like this thread needs some honesty. You’re focusing specifically on McDonalds because it’s not well regarded or liked these days so it’s makes your example woman “more undesirable” than if she were just a barista. All of this is really a smokescreen tho because in going for specificity I think you’re trying to avoid what I consider to be a well accepted relationship fact of American life. Can’t speak to other contraries. When those guys are saying a HVM would date a barista, what they are alluding to is the fact that in the USA, an attractive woman has a much much much higher chance of marrying above her financial and educational level than an attractive man. Period. Full stop. That’s true in this country and I feel like this thread is trying to bypass this which is silly and avoidant of reality. Put aside McDonalds and Barista.. A male investment banker making over 750k can fall in love and marry an attractive middle school teacher and nobody will bat an eye at that..not his family and not his fiends despite the fact that she would not be in his social or financial or educational circle. A female making 750k won’t look twice at an attractive male teacher beyond perhaps a one night stand..because her family and friends would stop her from dating down. If you’ve worked in corporate America I’d be willing to bet that you had a boss or a director/higher up who married his secretary. The boss may have gone to a fancy school…but the secretary likely didn’t. That doesn’t make her bad or unintelligent..but that guy is looking for a good fit for him and her job and financial level is not a prerequisite like it would be for a woman. We can get into the minutiae all we want and I hate the word I’m about to use…but that attractive woman, no matter her job, can marry out of her “station” in life in a way that a man cannot.


ChibsFilipTelfordd

> an attractive woman has a much much much higher chance of marrying above her financial and educational level than an attractive man. Period. Full stop. That’s true in this country It's not just true in this nation its true throughout human history. Yet it's a societal observation and attributing individuals choices to that observed trend is fallacious.


hatit516

Well said with the only exception to the rule is Jeff be sos x wife who married a teacher


NockerJoe

Madonna is "dating" a latin dancer with abs younger than half of the people here. The idea that high value people only go for others exactly like them has literally never been true. I remember growing up it wasn't *that* uncommon to see even in relativley high income middle class women they'd break off some cash for a lazy 20something who'd throw dick their way in exchange for drug money.


RPslimjim

Madonna is in her 60s acting like a teenage girl. Remember when she sexually assaulted drake? Please don’t use entertainers and athletes in the high value discussion bc they’re outliers and do not represent the majority.


EdwardCircumcizehand

Welcome to the top of the food chain, sorry, but they’re going to be the most brash and carnal expressions that you can find - unfortunately, they’re certainly people like the rest of us tho and are valid to consider


KingInTheNorthVI

Damn


thetruthishere_

My parents and friends would look down upon me for turning down a good man because of that. I know women are out there like this but its hard to find good people on either side thats compatible. I think it happens more often than not and that woman would date the teacher. My family and friends would have no issue if I dated a garbage man as long as hes a good man and good to me. They dont care about 'status' they care Im treated well and happy.


Dagenius1

Good for you, specifically. That doesn’t change the general truth of what I laid out.


DesperateTraffic3164

>The fact is that in the USA, an attractive woman has a much much much higher chance of marrying above her financial and educational level than an attractive man. Period. Full stop. That’s true in this country and I feel like this thread is trying to bypass this which is silly and avoidant of reality Of course that's true, but the idea only looks matter is retarded. The vast majority of men making 750K are not marrying / LTRing middle school teachers or even considering it. >If you’ve worked in corporate America I’d be willing to bet that you had a boss or a director/higher up who married his secretary I don't think you're getting the point of the thread. The whole 'McDonald's' argument is said by TRPers who are indicating that being hot is all that HVM care about, and its just plainly not. Being hot gets you a ticket to the dance, but you need WAY more attributes than that to be prom queen. I don't know any CEOs who married their executive assistants, but I can tell for certain that the reason this happens isn't because these women are just hot. It's because CEOs realize these women are intelligent, competent, respectable, hard working, and add value to their lives - often after years of getting to know this person. You're also wrong, no executive assistant to a CEO of even moderate repute is getting in the door without a degree and a great track record of success. The majority of HVM are not spending years in a working environment with an executive assistant, so guess what they filter on for the same outcome? Pedigree, career, family background, etc. >We can get into the minutiae all we want and I hate the word I’m about to use…but that attractive woman, no matter her job, can marry out of her “station” in life in a way that a man cannot. Water is wet. We all know this. The criticism I have is that people in the TRP community are telling women - don't worry about your education, or career, or goals - it won't help you get a HVM. And that's just plainly bullshit. It 100% will...if you are hot.


hatit516

Do you personally know many ceo ? Or are you just going by the 10 well known ceo you saw on Forbes list?


DesperateTraffic3164

I know 100s of CEOs. I'm an LP in several venture capital firms, an angel investor, and an advisor to startups through Series B companies. A non-trivial number of the companies I've advised have been acquired or exited giving their CEOs 8+ figures in networth.


OmarNBradley

Hey I interviewed some of your kind back when I wrote a history of a certain VC org. All those guys were married to accomplished women. I agree with your point, with one caveat. There is indeed a certain type of "HVM" who will marry a Hooters waitress or her equivalent. However, even these guys only do so *after* marrying and having a family with a woman who is more of their statusmatch. They might divorce her and marry a hot bimbo, but their children by their first wife either remain their only children, or remain the only children they really give a damn about. To wit, Howard Marshall Jr., Jeff Bezos, Donald Trump.


EdwardCircumcizehand

OP is lying, dude lol Ask him to provide proof


OmarNBradley

I don't really care if he's lying or not, on the internet everybody is a dog


ChibsFilipTelfordd

> because CEOs realize these women are intelligent, competent, respectable, hard working, and add value to their lives Ah you just got so close to the point right here. Your intelligence, competence, work ethic and respectability (as you said) is not necessarily modulated by your station in life nor your career. Career is just a proxy for it.


RPslimjim

Or that the CEO spends so much time with this person anyways. She’s already acting like his wife without being his wife. I worked in IB and consulting and many MDs married their assistants because “It was like we were already married”.


mc0079

>You're also wrong, no executive assistant to a CEO of even moderate repute is getting in the door without a degree and a great track record of success. Good EA's have advanced degrees, are very smart, polished, well organized etc... and get paid a lot of money.


redback-spider

You make several mistakes: 1. you say only looks matter, would be the claim why people would date the lower class women, no her not being masculine a "boss" babe that fights with you who is the leader is another reason. 2. you make a cause vs correlation mistake, you see lot's of man date on their level, besides the social group thing you mentioned, spending more time with them, you also have very very few mc donalds workers that look great vs highly succesful women that look great. When I watch at least american videos the average mc donalds worker is a 35 year old super obese black women. Sure I generalize a bit, and I am sure that are not all, but seems to me most. While it's a known fact that looks correlate heavily with success, because we descriminate against ugly people. So the reason your friends date more succesful women is because the average successful women look better than the average mc donalds worker.


Im_The_Daiquiri_Man

You are going full reductio ad absurdum here. Change it from a McDonald’s worker to a Barista. Now what? They would and they do date those women, all the time. IF she is hot *enough* Your own hang ups about your families judgment are irrelevant. A man with balls wouldn’t give a flying fuck what their snooty sister or judgmental mother thought.


E-2-butene

I’m not sure I’d call it a reductio. At least a successful one. But I agree there’s something about comparing it to fast food that just viscerally feels more distasteful than something like barista. All I know is my good looking, 6’3” friend with a Ph.D. married a Starbucks barista.


DesperateTraffic3164

I don't know any successful men dating Starbucks baristas, no idea where you pulled that example from. I've never even heard of this as something being remotely common. >A man with balls wouldn’t give a flying fuck what their snooty sister or judgmental mother thought. Don't cut yourself on all that edge Morpheus.


Im_The_Daiquiri_Man

Well, I know plenty that do. And bartenders and waitresses. Nobody’s gonna say shit about her job if she looks like Margot Robbie or Emily Ratjkowski. Men are not women. Well, *most* men aren’t, apparently.


DesperateTraffic3164

You know *plenty* of HVM who are dating Starbucks baristas? What industry do they work in and how much money do they make? This reeks of a lie. >Nobody’s gonna say shit about her job if she looks like Margot Robbie or Emily Ratjkowski. I don't know who either of those people are. Only idiots asking to get divorced pursue women based purely on their looks. Her pedigree and background is way more important for a sustainable LTR. There are plenty of awesome, attractive, well educated, financially stable women who are on your intellectual level. Why settle for a random girl from McDonald's who is probably in it only for the money? Makes no sense.


not_AtWorkRightNow

Matt Damon married a bartender…


DesperateTraffic3164

Do you think Matt Damon marrying a bartender is even remotely close to the norm?


Spacct

Christian Bale married a woman who used to be Winona Ryder's assistant Jon Bon Jovi married a karate teacher Alec Baldwin married a yoga teacher Jon Stewart married a veterinary technician Sundar Pichai (head of Google) married a business analyst, which is just a regular office job Patrick Dempsey married a hairdresser One of the Jonas brothers also married a hairdresser Terry Crews' wife doesn't have a job aside from their reality show as far as I know Vince Vaughn married a real estate agent


not_AtWorkRightNow

You said you don’t know any successful men dating starbucks barristas. But there’s an extremely high profile example of almost that exact situation that I can think of off the top of my head. Now you’re moving the goalposts to just saying it’s not the norm. Well in my experience it is. You’re all over this thread too desperately trying to make this point too. Seems like you have some sort of bias here to me.


DesperateTraffic3164

Yes, I do not know Matt fucking Damon, do you? I was obviously talking about my personal experience, not scouring the internet to find one-off examples of this obscure pairing that someone else said happened *pretty frequently.* >Now you’re moving the goalposts to just saying it’s not the norm. Well in my experience it is How am I moving the goalpost, when the commenter I was responding to literally said this was pretty frequent, and then you did too? Who are all the HVM dating baristas you know. What industry and how much money do they make? >You’re all over this thread too desperately trying to make this point too. You mean responding to comments in my own thread? You got me detective. >Seems like you have some sort of bias here to me. Got me again, I am biased towards my own opinion which I believe is correct.


not_AtWorkRightNow

Yeah you seem like some kinda rich investment banker who got rejected by a hot waitress or something. Like, you seem to have a weirdly emotional interest in making this point of yours.


redback-spider

My brother a doctor (not medical) that teaches on a college and tried to become a professor married a nurse which is not a college degree here and is looked down on here a lot. But his boss on the first private high earner college married his secretary. All his friends from the "high school" that (have different college degrees either business working at a bank with high earning or IT) all have good careers, married down, too, often east-euope foreigners because they were invisible to german often feminist women of all walks of live. Another factor is that often this man don't even tell what their women exactly do, because it does not matter, if you know them not very well, while you sure will learn as one of the first if the women catched a doctor or something. The story is more like ohh he finaly got any women, cool...


mairomaster

> Why settle for a random girl from McDonald's who is probably in it only for the money? Makes no sense. I will tell you one of the possible reasons why. Because she will probably fucking appreciate the husband she has. I will ask you the opposite - why marry a successful woman with flourishing career and great financial security, when she is so independent that she can divorce you any moment she wants?


hatit516

I disagree with that point. You know how many regular girl dated men with money yet they end up not keeping them long term. You will mostly hear a girl say they dated this type of guy and that but you never see them in a ltr with them so that appercation thing is false furthermore I seen women talk to men in high postion rude not giving a dam when the men didt do anything for that treatment. Women are rude to most guys on first term basis regardless of postion or income. But I’m not disagreeing with men not dating or marrying women on a lower income status or education lv then them. A man will get with a low lv worker if she has good quality for a ltr or pretty enough to sleep with


DesperateTraffic3164

That's the EXACT opposite of reality. In my experience, it's the women with no money who are hot and broke that have no appreciation of what HVM are bringing. They add literally no value besides their looks and get bored. All they know is 'sexy time goes in money comes out brrrr.' I knew an older man who worked in the real estate that basically LTRd an IG model, and she later admitted she did nothing all day and then literally slept with the pool boy - like the old porn trope. Hilarious. These are the women who divorce you because they know they can just take your money and provide themselves the same lifestyle. Career women or business women have empathy for what HVM are doing. Because they have done it themselves there is a respect and appreciation when you make certain moves in the world, and there is a real excitement about the future when something big is on the horizon. You can connect with a person like that, not just leave them to their devices to fuck the pool boy. These people don't get divorced nearly as often because they are purpose-driven - we are both working towards a mutual goal. It's very similar to having a business cofounder. When you're starting a company you want someone who believes in the same mission and has the drive to put the work in - not a fucking freeloader that's just in it for the money. The latter leaves, the former stays.


[deleted]

[удалено]


DesperateTraffic3164

You redpillers really love to try infer things about my personal life instead of engage with the ideas presented. Maybe an intelligence gap? Not sure. >Here's reality. When CEOs marry their secretary, an employee, etc, those girls aren't any 'better' than these fast food workers or baristas that you have been shitting on. Yes they are.


hatit516

Do you know many successful men personally?


Deadlocked02

Jeff Bridges, Matt Damon and Nicolas Cage all married waitresses/bartenders. I’m sure you can find other examples if you look into it.


ChrimsonChin988

>I don't know any successful men dating Starbucks baristas, no idea where you pulled that example from. So how many do you know that date fat chicks with a good career/education? That's the point. Not that HVM prefer McD employees.


DesperateTraffic3164

None. But that isn't the point TRP are making in my opinion. The correct point is: "Looks are important to HVM, but because they have their pick of all women, they can select far more attributes than that." What usually happens is the McDonald's line is used to imply that men literally couldn't care one way or the other what their partner does, so long as their hot. And that is false.


insertcredit2

You're missing part of the equation here which is looks = status. No very attractive women would work in fast food because she can get a better paid job in an instant. Men would be fine dating that very attractive waitress at the high end restaurant all of the guys lust over. Being very good looking is an immediate elevation of social status.


Khanluka

I think this saying exist cause alot of men dont care about there career. So why would we care about a woman career. For me there noiting more boring then to talk about my job. So here about somelse is a big turn of. Career focus poeple have there jobs as there identy. So talking about is big part of there life.


Blackagar59

Have sex with her? For sure. (when I was single) Date her just because she's hot? Nope.


pfizerface

Actually they would. That's the difference. Generally, Women date upwards. Men don't care.


-CuriousPanda-

Some men care, but there's enough that don't care that she could find someone to support her lifestyle easily. Few would be likely to commit to her though. Many would happily "date" her, almost none would commit long term.


Jakes1967

>High value men would not date a McDonald's worker just because she is hot This is absolutely the only demographic that truly doesn't care about a woman's job. >I keep seeing this brought up in TRP threads and Youtube videos, where someone says "High value Men don't care about your career. They'd date a McDonald's worker if they were hot enough." You're conflating HVM with men of status - not all HVM are men of status. A man of status (tenured professors, community leaders, chairman of the board etc.) won't marry for just looks. >I can say from experience falling into this cohort of men...that is almost certainly untrue. I don't know a single wealthy man who isn't dating someone in their same educational, income, or at least intelligence bracket - and you can't attribute that purely to social circles because many of these couples met through online dating. I know plenty of HVM and the ones without status, are/were the only ones dating more for looks. A few of my military buddies own businesses and off the top of my head, I can think of at least 3 who's wives are dumber than mud. >Intelligent successful driven people date people like them. If my family or friends asked what my wife did for work and I said 'she fixes people sandwiches' it would be utterly humiliating. From experience, it depends on his social standing and where in his process they met. If they met early on, she's likely to be less attractive and more intelligent. If they meet after he has made it, she's more likely to be more attractive and less intelligent. When social standing comes into play, the SO needs to be more intelligent, thus looks aren't a high priority.


ChrimsonChin988

>From experience, it depends on his social standing and where in his process they met. If they met early on, she's likely to be less attractive and more intelligent. If they meet after he has made it, she's more likely to be more attractive and less intelligent. Facts


WomenHavItHarder

Careers don’t matter that much for women. Women don’t need doctorates to marry doctors or dentists or other wealthy men. I know dozens of medical doctors who have dated or married nurses, CNAs, PAs, social workers, paramedics, ultrasound techs, and other women who had careers with lower education levels than doctors. I know dentists who have dated or married dental hygienists and orthodontic assistants. Yes, they’re not McDonalds workers but very few good looking women above a certain age are working those types of jobs. The only women I know (above the age of 20) who work non-management jobs in fast food are middle aged immigrant hispanics and overweight single moms.


zerofeetpersecond

Well there are plenty of guys making 100k who would be better of with McDonald’s worker than women’s studies major.


souljaxl

how much of a loser are you that you would be "utterly humiliated" because of your partners occupation.


Spacct

This is the mindset of the FDS crowd. The person doesn't matter, only their utility as a symbol to the other harpies does. It's why so many men get kicked by those close to them the second they're down.


veganbulk

Yuppies are like the weakest people on the planet. Mentally, physically and emotionally.


DesperateTraffic3164

If you think reputation doesn't matter to high value individuals, I've got some heartbreaking news for you.


Spacct

Nobody who would be 'humiliated' because of their partner's job is anything close to 'high value'.


MP8877

Lmao. Yes, please tell me about the 10/10 McDonalds girl that was still working there 6 months later… I’ll wait. This shit is absurd. Highly attractive, low status women are scooped up every day by HVMs. Yes, 7 figure earning men have access to the pick of the litter, which includes high status women who are also attractive. But that is not nearly the majority of HVMs. This post is a feminist delusion that wants female accomplishment to be part of society’s standards for women. Sorry…. It is, and always has been, genetics and looks.


dbz19

Exactly. So many women delude themselves into thinking a career makes them a better wife candidate, when that stuff doesn't appear on our radar. In all honestly, I'd rather a woman who prioritises her family over her career, who would rather spend time with her children than advancing her career. Who do you think is gonna prioritise their work more, a mcdonalds worker or a big shot like a CEO or a lawyer?


DesperateTraffic3164

Please tell me about all those 10/10 McDonalds workers that end up wifed up by rich men and not end up being sugar babies or single mothers. If you think this is common, you're delusional. >This shit is absurd. Highly attractive, low status women are scooped up every day by HVMs. For sex? No shit. For LTR/marriage? Not a chance. Maybe desparate losers with money who I wouldn't classify as HVM. >Yes, 7 figure earning men have access to the pick of the litter, which includes high status women who are also attractive. But that is not nearly the majority of HVMs. Nowhere near 7 figures is needed. 150k+ will do. I was making around $250K when I met my wife. >This post is a feminist delusion that wants female accomplishment to be part of society’s standards for women. Sorry…. It is, and always has been, genetics and looks. Nope. Time's are changing buckaroo. If you are a wealthy man, you would have to be an actual idiot not to vet a potential LTRs credentials before risking your assets. The likelihood a 10/10 McDonald's worker wants you for your glittering personality and not your cash is quite low to say the least.


hatit516

What dose your wife do? And credentials are not important for a ltr. Education, career ect is not important at all. I make a lot of money as well. I got with my fiancé for reason other then education. Those things don’t tell you if a women will make a good long term partner or a good mother or even if you guys mesh, it don’t tell you if the person is of good character, if the person is intelligent ect. Once you vent for education and income then what? All that tells you is what degree they have and how much they make which I don’t give a dam about because I make my own money to support a family all by myself


Stunning-Spirit5275

The last point...preach cuz 😎


hatit516

By your very argument coudnt a McDonald’s worker have high intelligence as education dose not mean intelligence, hence a high value man would date a McDonald’s worker? I’m strictly going off of your logic not what I think


sushiii2020

Water finds its level. People tend to date people who make around the same range as them. If you live in a big city in the US you simply need two incomes, most men do not make enough money ($300k+) to have a single income household


goatismycopilot

A man would have sex with, date, and keep a McDonald's worker as a side piece. They won't marry her or bring her home to mom. They would also do a SD/SB relationship.


SilverAndAlgorand

Obviously any decent man would not continue to let his woman work. Clearly you're low value.


TheHeroReditDeserves

This thread all but confirms most redditors are hopelessly plebeian and have no clue how any non-prols operate.


TryLambda

Is this post genuine?? Cos most men do not care what a woman does for a living, they only care if she is good looking, fun in bed and knows how to cook, sheesh if she's a McDonalds worker that would be a bonus, she can make you burgers after sex!


HOLYREGIME

You’re trying to use to word “McDonalds” to lower her value. Replace the word McDonald’s with Onlyfans, YouTuber, IG model, Tik Toker. That’s probably what the hot women are doing, not working at McDonalds.


GaryClarksJuniors

Idk, Joe Rogan for example married a cocktail waitress single mom 🤷🏼‍♂️


KirthWGersen

If you are talking marriage/living together, this is often correct. But if a man is looking for a lover, then all that matters (to him and his friends) is how attracted he is to her. The other women in his life may judge her for her social status, but the guys will totally understand why he is with her.


SplenduhP0py

I don’t care about a potential girls career one bit imo. But being hot isn’t the only thing i care about. So you are right, but for different reasons. Speaking from my personal opinion. Edit: Also i see nothing embarrassing with doing honest moral work. I could be earning Multi Million a year and if my wife wanted to open a sandwich shop and only make 27k a year, I don’t care as long as she is happy and its not a detractor from us or our family.


Throwaway90618

Until you get divorced and loose all your hard work to alimony and divorce settlements


That__EST

This. I think that many men's brains haven't caught up to the reality of the high divorce rate. You don't care what you wife does for a living until it causes you to lose a significant chunk of "your" money in a divorce.


Standard-Logic

Tell that to the 30% marriage rates of the current age. And, how much a wife earns and her career are one of the largest predictors of divorce. So the options are marrying someone who you'll lose more to, but with a much smaller chance of divorce, or marry someone who you'll lose less to, but with a much higher chance of divorce. Or do the third and most intelligent thing, don't get married. What's with you people and implying false dilemmas.


That__EST

I don't see it as a false delimma. You and I agree that deciding not to get married is the best thing over all. Life long monogamy is unrealistic. I truly believe that the percentage of happy couples (as in BOTH are happy with the arrangement) is a lot smaller than we will ever know. The only people who are truly without this "false delimma" are people who are confident in their decision to never have children. Because otherwise sure, you make peace with never marrying. Now you have the delimma as to whether you're going to possibly end up paying child support to a career woman or a woman who makes a lot less money than you do.


Spacct

Do you enter into all your relationships assuming you'll get divorced?


Withnail-

This is bullshit. Men date women of all economic backgrounds, it’s women who won’t “ date down” https://youtu.be/K9_cJ99Uyk4


veganbulk

As if we needed more evidence that this “high value” bullshit is just class prejudice. Remember you can’t be a HVM if you’re poor.


Ranziel

Poor people with shitty jobs can have other qualities beyond being a fine slampiece. But yeah, classism is a thing, but mostly with people who were born into wealth.


WilliamWyattD

I honestly think this thread has become a train wreck of people arguing when they primarily agree. It's basically about what is the threshold level of attractiveness for the woman. Is it 8, 7, or 6 out of 10? What exactly do those numbers represent, etc. Also, what is the sufficient amount of class or intelligence or accomplishment? At any rate, the point is that HVM typically are forced to consider a potential wife more holistically than their pure biological impulses would drive them to do. And then do this with tradeoffs using more threshold values where after a certain level, you get diminishing returns on hotness, but also on other traits as well. So yes, HVM choose wives in a way that more resembled how women choose men, but with women their biological drives already have the firmware for such holistic criteria. These men have this firmware partly installed by their culture and partly by conscious manual override. But let's not get ahead of ourselves and think these HVM are becoming just like women in their choice criteria. Also, from my experience, a lot depends on whether these HVM plan to get a lot of side action. I have seen the 'have my cake and eat it too' approach many times before.


Ruben_the_Fish

Sometimes. I say this as a low-paid retail worker who is with a project manager who drives a Benz. I hate to say this, but it depends on the woman and what she is like outside of her grind job- is she intelligent and well read? Does she have UMC values? UMC family?


gorilla_blanco

Exception doesn’t make the rule….. But…. There is a very nice newly built McDonalds by a new subdivision area in Orlando/Kissimmee that had a puertorican staff full of people who lived near the area/displaced by a hurricane wearing brand new uniforms looking very attractive serving breakfast to plenty of high earning, in shape, nice trucks and house owning construction businessmen who make TONS of Money. Little doubt in my mind those girls were getting asked out on the regular by all of these guys I would have taken a swing if I had been single… They all had wonderful personalities Bet they could all cook/loved with their families good girls, just seemed to be working there due to circumstances.


Over_Noise3530

Fast food workers definitely marry and date construction workers all the time, but that's irrelevant to op because we are talking about white collar men


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Intrepid_University6

How does working at McDonalds = dumb?


343_peaches_and_tea

> If my family or friends asked what my wife did for work and I said 'she fixes people sandwiches' it would be utterly humiliating. Sounds like you grew up with money. My ex and I dated for 6 years. For many of those she worked in a Subway. It wasn't a big deal. Two other women I've dated, including my wife, grew up on council estates. If my wife worked in subway or mcdonalds it wouldn't be a big deal. Sure, I'm not going to say no to her income. But I can live pretty frugally if need be. I think a big part of this has been not growing up with wealth or growing up around people who were wealthy. I do think we should make a big distinction between men who grew up with money and those who didn't. Joe Rogan for instance is still very much culturally working class even if he is loaded.


lartex93

Yes they will. Is not common because most high value men can find a hot girl in their social circle (Hot girls are much more abundant than HVM). So they are already dating there. But if a HVM looking for a relationship find a hot, charming and young Mcdonnalds worker, for sure he would go for her. (But a girl fitting that description would be rare aswell). So the chances of both meeting for romantic purposes would be rare. Plus hitting a cashier at her work would be wierd, specially if you are HVM you are not that thirsty. But if the HVM met this girl in a concert or something, 100% sure he would date her.


DesperateTraffic3164

Are you a HVM? Do you know any? Where are you getting this information from about what these men would do? I'm telling you for personal experience (lots of it) that what you're saying is not true, at least not for the vast majority.


lartex93

>Are you a HVM? Do you know any? Where are you getting this information from about what these men would do? Im a doctor on a surgical field, fit, decent face from a wealthy family. So I guess I qualify as HVM. I have so much options to date on the hospital from med students to attending doctors, to dentist, nurses, nutritionist. And every semester theres a ton of new young women to date, i dont have a move a finger to find new women, they come by theirself. This just at work. Im from a wealthy family so I have a big social circle outside of medicine, just like most of my friends who are all mostly engineers and few bankers and lawyers who can connect me with a ton of people. Same thing I can do for them. ​ >I'm telling you for personal experience (lots of it) that what you're saying is not true, at least not for the vast majority I can tell you i would 100% date a barista or mcdonnalds worker if shes hot enough and has a nice personality and I was single, but im always taken by someone on my own social circle, same for all my friends and other guys I went to an expensive university with. The supply of hot girls is just much more bigger than HVM, you can find hot girls everywhere and at any social circle. But HVM are limited to wealthy social circles, so yes it seems that could be another reason the 80/20 thing is a thing.


DesperateTraffic3164

How old are you? If you're just meeting girls to smash or hang out with a few weeks then sure that's normal. But almost no grown HVM I know would take your approach at a serious relationship/ marriage. It's just not smart.


lartex93

28, im not in the US by the way


DesperateTraffic3164

That's old enough you should know better. Like I mentioned in my edit, hopefully this is mainly for short term dating/sex and not LTR / marriage.


mairomaster

> That's old enough you should know better. Who are you to say what is better? The guy is 28, has a great education / career and enough life experience to be able to take those decisions himself.


DesperateTraffic3164

Clearly his life has been running on daddy's money up until this point. He actually doesn't disagree with me at all, he just didn't understand the original post. Based on his comments elsewhere he's also very probably lying.


lartex93

>short term dating/sex and not LTR / marriage. It could be true, but I think the reason is that as I said the offer of hot women for HVM is too high. Specially outside the US where is much harder to become wealthy and sucessful as a men because US economy is just much better. Theres few HVM, and hot girls keep poping everywhere. If there wasnt so much hot women willing to date me in my own circle I would 100% date and even LTR/marry a barista or Mcdonnalds worker if we get along. If I had to choose beetwen a hot barista and a wealthy-educated doctor that i dont find hot. me and 100% of hetero men would go for the barista. Guess why a lot of men end up cheating later with younger women? Looks-physical attraction is whats more important for men.


DesperateTraffic3164

Well, sure obviously if there were no hot women left on earth then a hot barista would be the next best choice, but that's not the world we live in and it isn't how most HVM make choices in who to LTR. > Looks-physical attraction is whats more important for men. Physical attraction is the 'you must be this tall to ride' but if that's all you focus on on your LTRs are going to be a nightmare.


lartex93

>Physical attraction is the 'you must be this tall to ride' but if that's all you focus on on your LTRs are going to be a nightmare. HVM dont even care about having LTRs. As a HVM you have wealth, great social circles, amazing hobbys and vacations with family/friends. You can pull girls easily if you feel like it. Find a LTR fast if you want. And dump it if you like it. So no, NO LTR is gonna be a nightmare for a HVM. Heck, you can dump a girl and have a next one in a week. You are pretty lost here in how big is the bargain power of a HVM and if you dont understand that you wont ever get it.


DesperateTraffic3164

>HVM dont even care about having LTRs. Completely untrue. Now I'm wondering if you're lying. >So no, NO LTR is gonna be a nightmare for a HVM. Almost all millionaire's are married. >You are pretty lost here in how big is the bargain power of a HVM and if you dont understand that you wont ever get it. You are definitely LARPing.


mackenzie013_02

Eh, I don’t think this is a “unattractive wealthy woman”vs “attractive poor woman”. It’s more of a ..both are attractive and HVM will chose the one with multiple attributes.


lartex93

Yes what you say is true. But OP make it sound like HVM are not interested in the cashier because of her education level-wealth status, which isnt true. In reality HVM are interested. But HVM just have much options that they just stay in their social circle for convenience.


hatit516

I think op just got into a field that pays a lot of money but Didt come from money, then watch red pill theory videos…


mackenzie013_02

That’s not how I read it. I read it as they wouldn’t date a girl ONLY because she’s hot; they do care about all these other attributes. Being hot isn’t enough (unlike what most men on here claim).


IHaveSalesQuestions

I agree. Most will not. The ones who will are the minority. Social circles and being able to carry yourself and speak intelligently means something. If you’re going to an outing or dinner party and your guest is good looking but dumb that reflects poorly on you. Most people think they know high value but do not.


lartex93

Is not like all cashiers working at mcdonnalds are some kind of trashy or dumb girls. Theres a ton of them working there while going to university.


ChibsFilipTelfordd

A truly HV man has options. A hot waitress is inferior to a hot career women for liberally minded men. A hot waitress is inferior to a hot housewife for conservatively minded men. A HV man whether liberal or conservative will be able to secure one of the superior variety, almost by definition


Barely-moral

It is about social circles. Not only because it is easier for those men to meet and interact with women similar bro them in status but because their families and associates will judge them harshly if they seriously date "one of those people" Source: I am a well earning lawyer that is seriously dating a woman I met in a homeless shelter. I had to cut a lot of people from my life. Thing is, i don't care about people that don't fit into the roles I want them to play in my life. Most men do.


Devourer_of_felines

I'd certainly date a McDonald's worker if they were hot and had a good personality. > I don't know a single wealthy man who isn't dating someone in their same educational, income, or at least intelligence bracket The fact that you think someone working a low status job at one specific point in their life is indicative of their education or intelligence bracket tells me you're not a good judge of either.


dbz19

I don't really consider myself HVM, but I would absolutely date a McDonald's worker and wouldn't have a single problem with her job at all, as long as she's a nice person, I get along well with her personality, and the physical attraction is there. She could be a McDonald's worker or a nuclear scientist, it makes no difference to me. I do not consider having a better career to mean a better woman.


SabineLavine

Sure they would.


DeJuanBallard

Thats because women in those brackets pursue them. But it is absolutely true, the downside is if your smart you know the mcdonalds worker is using u for ur money. But it's also a bit of an exagerrration. It may not literally be a cashier.


ruboyuri

They totally would They just won’t marry her


asdf333aza

A lot for the wives and GFs of these high value guys that you all want usually don't have anything going for them except that they look good OR looked good in the past. Their careers and other accomplishments are secondary. A lot of chick's are famous simply for being associated or sleeping with a hvm.


alialahmad1997

I can't speak for everyman Nor would I know if i am considered a high value man But i am a 6.1 freashly graduated doctor I would not mind dating a fast food worker if she was hot and nice and she showed interest in me My only fear is if we married and divorced about alimony so with a prenup i litterly see no downside Yes a career and ambition is nice but it is a bouns as long as she was hot in the biggening of the relationship and continued to treat me well through it that is more than enough


Placher1

Yea show me a woman that dates a low value man because he's hot. I'll wait


utopista114

Jeremy fucking Meeks


FlicksterTrickster

A woman saying what men won’t do. lol


Five_Decades

TRP simplifies things way too much and assumes all men care about is short term mating and obtaining validation from sex. People are more complex than that.


ChrimsonChin988

The human mind's inclination to think black/white and think of scenarios where a metaphor doesn't apply never ceases to amaze me. The point that someone who says this is trying to make is as follows: There are too many ladies that believe their education/career etc is of a lot of value to (HV) men. The fact is, especially when a man makes good money himself, he cares little about a woman's education and especially about how much or little she makes. Other qualities, like physical attractiveness is much more important if not the most important for guys. Men tell women the McD metaphor to set their priorities straight. If you're looking for a relationship with a man, especially a high value one: Go to the gym, take care of your skin, your diet; your appearance. Instead of your primary/only focus being your education/career. ​ Of course HVM are not looking for McD employees. Most are looking for a woman from a good family that is well connected, intelligent, pretty, traditional, fit, submissive, cooperative, friendly etc. Most women do not and never will qualify for a HVM based on these parameters: the point is that the ones who are potentially qualified are too much focused on their education/career as opposed to the other qualities I mentioned and I will decrease their odds at finding the 'right' partner.


-CuriousPanda-

I strongly disagree with the premise of "a really hot woman working at McDonald's." If she's actually hot (and not one of these 300lb chicks with "body positivity" delusions), then she will have a huuuuuge swath of opportunities to monetize her looks through modeling, instagram/tiktok influencing, OnlyFans, Porn, or prostitution. It's definitely possible for a hot girl to work at McD's, but for it to occur she would have to also be exceptionally dumb, or exceptionally morally opposed to using her looks to earn money. The opportunity and ease she would have to earn 5X a McDonald's salary through other means is incredible.


DjangoUBlackBastard

Not even modeling or using the internet. A beautiful woman can become a waitress at a high end restaurant and easily earn $1000+ a week. My GF works part time (3-4 days a week) and makes at least $600 a week. She started wearing makeup and earns closer to $700-800 a week now. No way a beautiful young woman won't just become a server and earn that type of money off tips. When I went to college the Hooters in campus is where all the girls went to work and then Drake shouted it out in a song and they started making great money there.


20Humble5050

Correlation does not equal cause - I think that a woman being clever and intellectually stimulating is far more important to a smart or otherwise high-value man than her actual career or credentials, i.e. working a low-ranking job would not be a dealbreaker. The thing is that women that check those boxes don’t tend to end up in such positions beyond temporary summer jobs and such.


RRBeachFG2

McDonald’s is just an example, I mean I’m sure you’ve never heard of the rich old guy hitting the the waitress or hostess but that’s crrraaazzzyyy


Moneydamjan

if she was hot feminine kind and nurturing, yes


Stevefr0mYellowstone

This is a combination of strawmanning and pinpointing the discussion on too narrow a scenario instead of focusing on why this topic comes up. The 10/10 at McDonalds getting wifed up by the rich CEO is a strawman argument that is extraordinarily unlikely to ever happen in the first place because its not going to come up period. A 10/10 is not working at McDonalds for very long. In most situations she never works there in the first place. If she does work there she very quickly moves onto something else where she can take advantage of her beauty. Or if she gets in a relationship with a well to do guy she very quickly quits the job at McDonald because he's fine with her not working at all or he can help her get a more "respectable" position. You're trying to present this scenario where a rich CEO refuses to be with a woman because at a get together he doesn't want to introduce to his colleagues his wife the McDonalds cashier. By the time he's taking her to such events she is long gone from McDonalds. This discussion typically comes up to explain how women's ever increasing standards are making things harder for them. A woman gets her bachelors, then her Masters, then her PHD. She moves up in her career, from entry level to management, to upper management, to C-suite. As those accomplishments/positions rise, her standards also rise. When she has her PHD and is in the C-suite, she wants a man who is also a PHD and in the C-suite. She isn't settling for the guy with a Bachelors's Degree or the Plumber. The problem is that the male she is looking for at her level doesn't care about those things. The male PHD CEO doesn't need to date another CEO. He doesn't need to date a woman with a PHD. Now sure, he's probably not going out to McDonalds and asking out the Cashier, but is he fine getting with a teacher? An Assistant Vice President at the local technology company? The chef at the local restaurant? IF she meets what is important to a man, looks, fertility, having a good personality, etc... the degree and position matters way, way, less. So these PHD C-suite type women have shrunken their pool of men considerably while the equivalent man has not. That's the thing to focus on.


Megabyte7637

Yea they would


Skycat9

Christ I wish people would stop with all this high value/low value language. It’s really horrible


deste_eloise

This is 1000% accurate. As a woman in that cohort, I don’t know one guy that would LTR a woman that isn’t wealthy and educated. Tho, people also have different perception of wealth.


lartex93

>This is 1000% accurate. It is not. Its just HVM have a lot of options in their social circles, so no need to bother going hitting random persons, specially a cashier at her work. But if said girl was met in a social event like a festival, ofc a HVM would take her if she was hot and charming enough. But guess what? HVM are already taken most of the time.


deste_eloise

I disagree. Wealthy men care about wealth, status, and education (their own words). They will date hot girls, but won’t LTR or take them seriously unless they bring other things to the table. 🤷🏼‍♀️ Tho as you say, exposure is minimal anyways, so I agree with that.


lartex93

>Wealthy men care about wealth, status, and education (their own words). They will date hot girls, but won’t LTR or take them seriously unless they bring other things to the table. Because real HVM can find hot girls anywhere. Wealth, status and education are not that important, but HVM can easily find a girl that is hot and has that aswell, so no point on going for a cashier if he has hot, wealthy and high social status girls in line. If a girl without all this traits wasnt avaiable to HVM and just being a hot mcdonnalds worker girl he would take her for sure and would be happy to LTR her and even marry if shes charming enough. But he has too much options on his circle so the cashier doesnt get the chance to date him. Theres simply much more hotter women than HVM. So HVM have a higher bargain power on choosing them.


chalkandapples

Being around a lot of people that makes a lot of money, my experience is that if only hot McDonalds workers are available, they would marry them but not happily. In reality most people like to marry someone they're similar to. A hot girl that you can't relate to isn't really someone that you would be excited marrying. I think men generally want to make more money than the woman, but isn't happy if the woman is leagues below him on competency and income bracket. Romantic relationships are not just about lust, to marry someone you need to respect each other and really enjoy each other's company in more ways than just sex. I'm sure they'll be happy to have sex with a hot woman that's a McDonald's worker, and treat her well, but most rich people would rather marry a less attractive woman that he can relate to more socioeconomically. The reality is that we see more billionaires/millionaires marry average looking women than someone that is not a professional or impressive career wise herself. I'm also not sure how you're defining HVM, what exactly is that? Just rich?


deste_eloise

If it wasn’t important then there’s absolutely no difference in going for a McDonald’s worker who’s a 10/10. It makes zero difference to choose a 10 that is also all those things vs not, if the things aren’t valuable. Anyways, I’m repeating what the men IRL say and how they behave. 🤷🏼‍♀️ Sure, maybe there’s some don’t care as much.


lartex93

>It makes zero difference to choose a 10 that is also all those things vs not, if the things aren’t valuable. Its not zero difference, but its not that much important really. Looks will always be 90% or more of the attraction equation for men. The thing is that as a HVM theres so much options that you would rather choose the whole package (Who wouldnt?).


deste_eloise

Isn’t that kinda the point? Education, wealth, etc. are a part of the package. With a base level of attraction; HVM will always choose the woman who is all those things. They won’t choose 10/10 barista when they have a 8/10 high status woman. If it had no value then it would be a coin toss; which it isn’t.


DesperateTraffic3164

This is **exactly** the point. At some level looks become diminishing returns on an investment. An 8 / 9 / 10 is not going to be that fundamentally different after 3, 4, 5, 6 years. Every man has some minimum threshold of attractiveness to pass GO (same way beautiful women have a minimum threshold of wealth/success), but once that threshold is reached there is a laundry list of other requirements that are also important. No wealthy man is going to choose the super model bimbo who works at Starbucks with no valuable attributes over the hot biologist who went to Yale and who's family owns a construction business. It just does not happen that way in the real world. These comments are showing me who the pretenders are.


deste_eloise

We’re saying the same thing then. 😄


Im_The_Daiquiri_Man

You’re telling me if a guy met a girl that was a solid 10 at a bar or concert, took her on a date where she revealed “I am a bartender” that guy would just drop her? Sure, Jan.


shadowkittn

He might waste her time hooking up or dating, but the chances of him marrying her are pretty slim. I used to work at a county club as a server and yeah... no Anna Nicole Smiths in sight.


deste_eloise

He will go out with her, then replace her with another option. Very unlikely he will LTR her. 🤷🏼‍♀️


DesperateTraffic3164

Yes. Do you not think actors / ball players / CEOs are not inundated by 10s with shitty jobs everywhere they go? Yet for some reason they are all exclusively dating people from elite educational background and great careers. Why do you think that is? Keep being in denial all you want.


Jamless_universe

He will fuck her once or a few times then move on. He will look for a woman who can support herself instead of depending on his money for LTR. This ain't the 1950.


Apprehensive_Boat_70

These women really think that for a man to marry a sandwich maker is humiliating but marrying the leftovers of the whole college football fraternity is in every man's bucket list, lmao, a man that would actually feel humilliated if he married a sandwich flipper at some restaurant just has standards but a man that feels repulsed by a woman's sexual past is insecure and has a fragile ego, lmao, it seems that insecurity and fragile ego only applies if the though police approves of it.


dysonRing

This is so ridiculous because it ignores the elephant in the room Marriage -> Divorce -> Lose half your wealth. Of course most if all old money marry old money, I am kinda glad I don't belong to those social circles, so I can pursue my desires and not cut off 99% of the female population. Also what most consider attractive is pretty relevant, I don't see many high society or highly educated women really being 10/10s I am sorry I am not interested in the girl next door type. Also I don't discriminate on intelligence, I just find whatever women find intellectually stimulating and go for that, for the nerdy topics I will debate men. In short if I were at the beach and saw a sufficiently attractive woman in a bikini, and she was a good person, I would consider a LTR regardless of career, education, intelligence or employment, she could be a sanitation worker for all I care.


SteveSan82

HVM will choose a hot McDonald’s worker over a Middle Aged mechanical engineer


EstablishmentKooky50

One part of the problem is the literal understanding of the examples. An actual hottie flipping buns in the Mackie has about as much real life relevance as a rabbit beating the shit out of a Grizzly. The example is obviously exaggerated. The point is to show that men in general do not care about a woman's carreer nearly as much as women care about a man's career. That men and women have different priorities. This is the actual claim behind the example. So we can argue about how stupid the example is, but it's just gonna be a useless debate about the wrong thing (which makes up the majority if debates here on PPD tbh). Just because men have this trait considerably lower on their list of priorities then women, it doesn't mean that a high value man will choose a random 10/10 chick who's IQ is barely enough to enable her not to shit all around the front yard. These "arguments" are dishonest at best. Anyway, shame on you for being a social class [email protected] (No i don't mean it..)


Your_Couzen

A high value man will date anyone he wants with out fear of judgment of any man or women. Date even a McDonald’s worker. Status really doesn’t matter as much. Your trippin, now marry? Maybe that’s different yea. But you wrote date not marry.


womandatory

I agree. The problem, as usual, is TRP trying to determine what a HVM is and failing. A man, any man, who values looks above everything else is automatically low value. The crimson capsules might think they know women, but the glaring fact is they don’t know how women see men. A woman who doesn’t care that a man only values her (or any woman) for her looks is a LVW. A man who values women only for their looks is a LVM. OP is correct. Most people date and marry in their own economic, educational and social circles. The ones who don’t add to the divorce rate more than they create successful outliers.


WilliamWyattD

The 'High Value' in HVM is not some sort of true evaluation of his worth as a human being. It is simply his ranking in the sexual marketplace, and sometimes guys with shitty judgment still rank high.


LillthOfBabylon

>Intelligent successful driven people date people like them. Bold of you to assume the men making those claims are intelligent successful driven people. They're projecting their own fantasies on other people.


python834

This is false. I make low 7 figures a year, and I absolutely would date a girl and marry her if she is a mcdonalds worker, if she makes for a good wife for my kids, and is hot. Its just that nowadays, hot girls are monetized and on a fast track for promotions, and no longer need to work at mcdonalds, so you’ll never see them working there. I see hot girls get 5-6 promotions in a period of 3 years all the time. Some of these girls are fucking their managers, and the managers of their managers. All these attractive women will be in big positions, and will always be in wealthy social circles because wealthy guys want to hang with hot girls rather than ugly ones.


malin_w13

lmao .. “5-6 promotions in span of 3 years ALL THE TIME” - where do you work? This would generate complaints faster than the speed of light.


daddysgotanew

Haha. So naive. This happens everywhere. I’ve known multiple women who used their pussy to advance in the workplace


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Fleischpeitsch

That's the problem whenever low value men use their solipsism to make claims about what high value men would do. "high value men wouldn't date a slut" - no, in reality high value men don't even consider women that have sex to be sluts because they know that women can enjoy sex as well. It's actually just low value men that are having issues with non-virgin women because they are afraid that she has had a better partner before "high value men will never get married" - no, the MGTOW lifestyle is only something that struggling guys want to have as some sort of sour grapes downplaying of their needs. Guys had are able to get a lot of casual sex still enter relationships because it's better to have actual companionship, commitment and a possible future with kids and grandchildren "high value men don't care about her career" - no, that's just something struggling guys think because they would be happy about any warm hole. High value men also have higher standards and don't want to waste their time with someone that can't entertain them on an intellectual level as well That's why you should never listen to anything the struggling men here claim about what high value men want. They simply assume that their desperate, insecure and anxious preferences apply to all men.


Rylakb

What a dumb post. If the woman is that hot, there is no chance she would work at Mcdonald’s. She would be an instagram model. The most physically attractive women of this world have the ability to dodge these kind of jobs.


veganbulk

This guy thinks instagram model is a real job.


Lonelybuthopeful9

Post is dumb, but hot womens work at min wage jobs all the time


OwnerAndMaster

Good lord, you realize this is a data point that can be researched and either proven or disproven?


[deleted]

I'm a millennial that owns my home, build spaceships and I've got a pension from the military. I would date a McDonald's worker that was attractive, and had a kind personality.


Rieux_n_Tarrou

My high status friend began dating a barista a while ago. Since they've gone steady, she's started taking classes to up-skill into a very lucrative career. And together they've cultivated crafting hobbies which are both gratifying and potentially lucrative (if they wanted to monetize). Maybe the most high-status quality a man can have is to elevate those whom he brings into his life *noggin tap*