T O P
Heinz37_sauce

I would be very curious to know whether the women in this scenario would evaluate the guy’s past for consistency - that is, did he make ALL of his past girlfriends wait. The reverse has been discussed in this subreddit ad nauseum.


Oli_love90

I personally would not wonder “did he make his other girlfriends wait?” And just respect his request and enjoy my time with him. I don’t think other relationships matter in this case.


EdwardCircumcizehand

Yup, different people send different vibes You may like a person but they came off on the wrong foot and you have doubts, for instance


CatoftheBanals

Yeah. And please calculate the monetary value of all the goods and services he got for his previous girlfriends before sleeping with them. Since they regard relationships as purely transactional, if men don’t want to wait one nanosecond later than any previous guy who got it the soonest, then I don’t want to put out one penny before the woman who got the most stuff.


SuperSupremeKai

One two-hour date. 200$. My place. Deal or no deal?


CatoftheBanals

Ha. I don’t think so. I’m old and it’s past my bedtime as it is.


variedpageants

> I don’t want to put out one penny before the woman who got the most stuff. I'm sure you imagine this is some pithy "gotcha" response that invalidates the complaints of all men everywhere. But actually, it's a straw man. If a man somehow knew (and I have no idea how he would know this) that you usually bang a guy an hour after meeting him, he's not going to be there with a stopwatch whining, "it's been 60 minutes and 15 seconds where's the sex at??" But that's the implication of "one penny less" in your straw man. That's why it's a straw man. If you actually want to make an effort to understand how men feel (and I know, this is a ridiculous proposition right? LOLOL why would you **ever** give a shit about men??) then convert your analogy from the straw man of "one penny" into the general principle of how you're treated by a man. Imagine you've got feelings for a man - so you have to imagine that you find him attractive and you enjoy being with him. Imagine he insists on splitting the check. Now imagine that when he asked to split the check, you didn't just immediately dump him and go whine about it on FDS. Try (really try hard) to imagine that you actually like him, and you want to make it work. But the "going dutch" thing keeps happening. You keep putting up with it, but it keeps happening. So you discuss it with him, and he says that he used to buy women stuff, but he's just not into that anymore - that made him feel "used" and if you really like him, it wont matter. Then imagine that you find out somehow that he was really, *really* generous with past girlfriends. You learn about trips to Paris and expensive gifts. See? This isn't an issue of "one penny less" - this is about the general principle. In this scenario (assuming you're even capable of imagining this), you feel that he values you less than the last woman he was with. And nothing he can say, no speeches about how he was "a different person then" make you feel any better. It's not about the money, it's about how this man that you have feelings for, *feels about you*. You are right to suspect that he feels differently about you.


fakingandnotmakingit

But here's the thing. I *don't care* that he treated his ex gf to Paris. In fact if he told me that he's learned his lessom or whatever and now he's "more mature" and not spending lavishly until commitment/marriage it would be totally fine with me. Because people mature What matters to me is whether I'm happy with the way he treats me now and whether we agree on what heppens when we become more committed. Because I'm not a fucking numbskull


hellochoy

For me personally if i make a guy wait for sex it's only within the dating and getting to know him stage so if he took previous romantic interests to Paris as dates and then said that he felt used I'd take him at his word and pay half the check. When I really like a guy I honestly just want him to be happy, I'd take the whole check if I'm that into him and he lets me. I also think trust is pretty important in a relationship and if he says that he wants to split it because of past situations not working out when he was overly generous then I would just take him at his word and pay the check. It's really not that serious. If I'm on a second or third or fourth date with a guy I'm not going to expect him to spend a shit ton of money on me even if he did in past relationships and it's simply because I don't date guys for their money, I date them because I like them. I don't see people just as what they can spend on me because that's a pretty miserable mindset imo. Also I dont see how much money a guy spends on me in correlation with how he feels about me unless he doesn't spend that much money or time on me. And vice versa i wouldn't want to be with a guy that spends a shit ton of money on me but doesn't care to spend quality time. And to answer op's question it just depends on how long he wants to wait. If it's just until we get to know each other that would be fine and pretty cool but I don't think I'd wait until like marriage for anyone because I like sex lol. His previous relationships don't have much impact on my decisions because previous relationships are what the person did in the past and I would expect someone mature to learn and grow from that and do different things in their current relationship if they found that doing a specific thing in the past didn't work out so well


variedpageants

> trust is pretty important This is the key thing. If a woman tells you, "these are the rules for having sex" and you agree to those rules, then you find out there are different rules for different men, *that's a violation of trust*. I tried to create a hypothetical where you might feel the same way about a man. But, men and women are different and so, if you don't feel the same way, that's fine. I think you still get the point that it's a question of trust.


hellochoy

It's not a violation of trust unless she's dating those different men at the same time as you. As I said in my other comment, people should learn from past relationships and adjust. If a man took all his previous relationship prospects to Paris and found that they left him as soon as his money dried up and he decides to not spend that kind of money on prospects anymore that's a sign of growth to me. (I don't think anyone should spend that kind of money on something not guaranteed anyways since it opens you up to being used) If a woman had sex with all her previous relationship prospects on the first date and found that they left her as soon as she has a bad week and doesn't want to bang or they only start seeing her as someone to bang and she decides to wait to have sex with prospects until there's a deeper emotional connection, that's a sign of growth imo. I don't see how that could be a violation of trust anymore than the situation with the man is. The whole point of dating is finding what works or doesn't work for a person and adjusting to find the best relationship outcome. Do you disagree?


variedpageants

> that's a sign of growth imo. Yeah, I get you, and I'm trying to agree with you as much as I can. If I met a woman who said to me, "look, I made mistakes in my past *and I'm never going to do that again* - I have real regrets about it" then okay, I can try to get onboard with that. By contrast (and much more likely), I meet a woman who says, "no, I don't do that, I'm not like that" - but then it turns out she does do that, and is like that. There's no "growth" and no regret about past mistakes. Here's a really important part ---> *she doesn't even see the past as a mistake* She's not going to say, "I wish I hadn't done that." In fact, what usually ends up pissing guys off is that she, herself literally reveals her past through "fond memories" and stories she openly tells in front of her man. Hanging out with friends and she says to a girlfriend, "omg remember the time..." **That** is what I'm talking about. From the guy's perspective it's (1) meet a girl, (2) told to jump through hoops because "I don't do that" (3) be as accommodating as possible (4) find out that these were extra rules just for you.


hellochoy

In that situation, unless she's dating others at the same time as you (emphasis on at the same time as you, as opposed to in the past) then it wouldn't be dishonest to say "I'm not like that, I don't do that". Because even if she was like that, she's clearly not now. It's not saying "I've never done that and I never will" it's just saying that's not how she is at the moment. Whether she's done it in the past or not is irrelevant. I could say "I don't smoke, I'm not like that" and still be honest even if I used to smoke in the past. People can and should change and adjust in the pursuit of being the best person they can be and shouldn't be called dishonest for doing so. About your point of fond memories, what's so bad about thinking about fun stories and focusing on the good parts of past relationships? Would you want to be with someone that only talks about the negatives of their past? Just because something didn't work out before doesn't mean that there were never good parts and that if there were they shouldn't be talked about. I think the fundamental part that I disagree with you on is the "extra rules just for you" part. The extra rules aren't FOR YOU (sorry I don't know how to use bold font on here so I'll just capitalize). The rules aren't for you, theyre actually boundaries that the woman is setting for herself. Usually it's nothing personal and you shouldn't take it as so because it doesn't have anything to do with you so much as it's about her setting boundaries to protect herself and strengthen the bond of the actual relationship. You get what I'm saying?


PreparationWorried33

Exactly! People grow and change. Assuming they value you less than last prospects says a lot about your ego and insecurities. You’re making *their* boundaries and growth all about you.


hellochoy

Definitely this. I feel like people on this sub put too much emphasis on what people did in their past relationships as if they're supposed to just keep doing the same things in every single relationship. Obviously if you did something in the past and found out it kept resulting in you being mistreated it would be pretty stupid to continue to do it in future relationships. Has nothing to do with the new person, it's just changing your patterns for a better outcome. I'm glad to see someone else understand that! And honestly it's a red flag for a current relationship prospect to get upset with you for adjusting and trying to set new boundaries in order to not get hurt. I wouldn't want to date someone that analyzes everything you've done for someone in the past and expects you to do that for them too, especially if doing so led you to get hurt like where's the empathy and care?


PreparationWorried33

I agree with everything you said, but the second paragraph especially is golden! There is no empathy and care. They’re purely looking to see what they can get from the other person and they become enraged if they feel it’s “less” than what someone else got.


hellochoy

Wow we really got to the root of it huh! So it's just selfishness all along. Thanks for the chat and I wish you luck in your current and/or future relationship endeavors!


Sekina7

THANK YOU! They don’t realise this shows their complete lack of empathy and inability to see women as anything other than vessels to gratify them ONLY. It’s fucking sickening to be honest.


Sekina7

This is the best comment I have ever read on PPD! Bravo 👏 .


Apprehensive_Boat_70

Ok mate, the day women start dating pathetic simpletons who used to pay for only fans content, men who frequented strip clubs, prostitutes and escorts, bi men or men who had gay encounters in the past, previous incels or cash cows of all the gold diggers in the town will be the day i ll make exceptions for an ignorant woman who used the be the personal pleasure ego trip machine of the whole football club, but until then I tell them no, especially when the lie about it and say "no im not like that im a total white pigeon". Most women talk about how the past is the past, empathy and that, but all that goes down the sink the moment they are the ones that have to compromise, so lets see if they lead with the example.


hellochoy

So you're saying compromising by dating someone with questionable morals or character (except for the bi men, how is that a compromise?) is equal to compromising by waiting to have sex? How are the two equal at all? I get what you're saying though and I think the thing is that men can and do also put up boundaries. Like the example of the man only paying for half a meal and believe it or not some women do compromise on that. And their partner should do the same for them. Barring special circumstance where a person asks for compromise regarding something ridiculous or abusive like no contact with family or something because it's toxic or dangerous. Asking to wait to have sex isn't toxic or dangerous though. Also some women for whatever reason do date those men that you listed. Not every man that does those things is walking around single. Some women tolerate it and some just don't know and some don't tolerate it. Also I don't see how dating a man who explored his sexuality in the past is compromise either and I think women having an aversion to those men is rooted in homophobia but that's a whole other conversation that I'm not trying to get into.


CatoftheBanals

Wow. I triggered you. I don’t believe relationships are transactional. But if you’re going to make them that way, apply it fairly. I don’t know what my exes spent on their previous dates. Why would I care? My exes didn’t know my sexual history and I didn’t know theirs. Why would we care? Most grown-ups discard that competitive mentality and point-scoring and power-tripping. How your partner treats you is proof of their feelings. It’s all the evidence you need. The end.


dingdongitslong

Totally disagree plenty of people give a shit if about a partners past it explains a lot about them. Only a fool would act as if a partner who a huge body cou t or shady past partners don't matter


CatoftheBanals

I don’t think “how many people have you slept with” ever came up in any relationship after college. It was viewed as a question asked only by the deeply insecure. In any event, it’s not something you can verify. You have to trust your partner.


PreparationWorried33

You really wrote this entire essay to argue semantics because you don’t understand hyperbole. I highly doubt they literally meant one penny less. The trie comparison was, they’re not spending more than his exes did. I highly doubt they’d nickel and dime things. As for the rest of what you said. Some people would care and others wouldn’t. They either respect the persons boundaries and go along or move on. People make mistakes and they learn and grow. Maybe he realizes recklessly giving women money was a bad idea, so he doesn’t want to do that anymore. That’s fair. You either accept it or you don’t. It’s ridiculous to frame it as you being given less than others/shortchanged/scammed etc. Tying their growth as a a person into your value is a bit egotistical.


CatoftheBanals

Hoes mad, man.


variedpageants

I'm sorry that I triggered you. The other commenter made a joke that involved a straw man and I expressed the opposing position directly. If you disagree with something I said, then feel free to let me know.


PreparationWorried33

Triggered implies a negative emotion. I simply found it hilarious and ridiculous that simple semantics enraged you that much. To the point that you took it seriously and then assumed it meant the other person couldn’t/didn’t want to understand men’s feelings. I disagree with everything you said though and did let you know. The comments edited so should be there now.


variedpageants

enraged implies a negative emotion. I simply found it dishonest to use a straw man, so I corrected it.


PreparationWorried33

There was no straw man.


variedpageants

there was a straw man.


PreparationWorried33

Hyperbole is not a straw man. There was no straw man.


SuperSupremeKai

>The reverse has been discussed in this subreddit ad nauseum. Promiscuity in men has almost always been viewed differently than women. That is one of the few double standards that benefit men, and for a few reasons. That is why it is not talked about much, because in the end does a woman truly question maternity much when her child is born? Diseases, cheating and treatment on the other hand...


MelisandreStokes

People can change, there’s no problem with a guy who was slutty in his youth and grew up to realize sex is better kept to committed relationships. As long as he’s clean lol


Desmo4488

How do you know they've actually changed? Would you date a serial dater? They're more likely to have unresolved issues they have not dealt with on their own yet. If they're making you wait, they're most likely keeping their options open.


CimZim

I would, yes. Be very foolish not to. If his friends make comments about him previously being a player, and his social media is filled with pictures of him in clubs, drinking, arms around lots of women, spring break type events, etc then he was probably part of hookup and ONS culture. If he's telling me he wants to wait now, I've no interest in trying to turn a manwhore into a househusband. A person's past matters. I'd only date a man who was never in that subculture and had a low N like me.


Desmo4488

Someone being pragmatic, so rare nowadays. I find it so naive when people say their past doesn't matter, or "it shouldn't matter," when it really does. People who cheat, have lots of hookups, serial daters, all are more likely to not commit and struggle because they have issues they have not dealt with on their own yet. If they suddenly make a person wait they're keeping their options open while tagging them along.


redkoicarp

Not all of us are that suspicious. If he felt things were moving far too fast the last time and how sex screws with your emotions, it's only logial and understandable he has learned from his experience and decided to make it better (thus, wating longer) the next time. Not everyone has to apply the same logic some men here (with some clear issues) are applying to women here.


PlayfulLawyer

I wouldn't say most women, but there's some that will, also depends on how long you're talking about in terms of waiting , just never forget that she has more sexual options than you, and depending on how long the wait is she probably won't be afraid to use them


idrinkapplejuice42

This is what annoys me. I dont naturally want to be pushy, but now I realize that if Im not somebody else will be. And since most women dont hold out Im likely to lose my shot.


PlayfulLawyer

Well if you hold true to your principles eventually you'll find the right one or just learn to vet has carefully as possible even though there is no 100% guarantee


moresleepy1

nah he will die alone your giving bad advice. OP your gonna end up being bitter and resentful that all the women you would like to date have large sexual histories and expect you to know how to be good at sex when you have no practice. if you want to try this strategy out you better be very attractive.


CimZim

Most women do not have large sexual histories, unless you think 7-10 partners is large. And some of us have less than 5.


PreparationWorried33

They like to claim on this sub that women with N under 10 are lying and underreporting.


CimZim

I know, some of the guys here don't understand that some of us aren't a part of hookup culture and don't want a large amount of partners, that we greatly prefer LTRs instead of ONS.


PreparationWorried33

Yep! It’s unfathomable to them.


dingdongitslong

Lots of guys here are bitter and angry towards women so anything negative they throw at them. I for one know a lot of women who are not part of hook up culture and have respect for themselves


dingdongitslong

You're basically calling all women sluts there are plenty of women who don't just sleep around


Desmo4488

Making a person wait for sex is such a bad strategy, and it weaponizes sexuality. It only works for those who have a low N count or have a low libido because it is consistent with their past history, otherwise the person is wasting their time.


CimZim

I think there's more of us who would gladly date a man who not only understands that we don't want to jump in bed immediately, but also shares the same sentiment, than you realize.


gucciwillis

People like sex though. If you're going to make her wait, how can you expect her to not have sex with someone else? You can continue to date her if she's having sex with someone else and as soon as you consummate your relationship tell her that it's now exclusive. How are you going to have an exclusive relationship if sex isn't involved?


Insidious-Sid

What makes women respond is this mysterious moving target. A lot of what amounts to success with them is numbers and luck. You moved too fast with this one and moved too slow with this other one. You can't quantify this stuff. It's ridiculous. It's a video game set to "random mode". There is no pattern.


Gigamon2014

I find this to be true. Hence I don't have try and cater to women's wants and needs at all. Other than my SO.


idrinkapplejuice42

I have to keep this in mind.


Reisiluu

If you want to wait, make it crystal clear that you are interested sexually and romantically, and that you are looking for long term commitment. A guy who doesn't make any moves is just a friend, and a woman with a friend is still single.


Desmo4488

So based, this is the way to go. People play hard to get or make a person wait long-term without explicitly telling them they are sexually and romantically interested, this only works if they make it crystal clear as you said.


herefortheparty01

Women talk a lotta game about this. Saying they’d wait. I usually wait a month before sex. I’ve had one partner this year. She moved away. But I’ve went on many dates. Most women don’t want to wait.


idrinkapplejuice42

Lol this is my feeling. Can I ask how you pursue women? I think maybe I need to make romantic intentions clear especially if Im not trying to sleep with them right away which ive struggled to do in the past.


herefortheparty01

I literally ask straight out if she wants another date


idrinkapplejuice42

Sorry if this sounds dumb.... But how do you ask a girl out on a date? What things do you usually suggest? Do you use the word date?


herefortheparty01

I ask her out to something I enjoying doing


Desmo4488

This, everything you see on the internet is mostly people virtue signaling so they can appear "better" morally to what in ideals is considered attractive. When in reality no one actually follows through in the moment, they're more focused on how they feel than what they thought.


dbz19

> Most women don’t want to wait. They'll change their minds once they actually genuinely fall in love with you and start fantasising about you and so on and so on. This happens later in the relationship, but once it's starting off, they have no problem saying they want to wait until marriage. Honestly once you know you love each other, you shouldn't wait long to get married. It's fine to get married even if you've only known each other for a year. I know it's a super controversial opinion but it's how I feel.


SirTruffleberry

I mean, this is definitely the sub for spouting controversial things, but you still have to try to connect the dots. I don't see how the existence of love implies marriage. Marriage almost always threatens one partner financially, for the benefit of the other. It frankly isn't clear to me that it ought to exist. Source: Once married, lucky enough that the ex-wife had mercy and didn't fight for my assets.


dbz19

> Marriage almost always threatens one partner financially, for the benefit of the other. I think most people don't think that way. Most people see it as the culmination of a romantic love.


SirTruffleberry

So let me ask you this: If we got rid of the legal trappings and reduced marriage to a ceremony and certificate, would you still feel that way? I think many see the legal status as essential.


dbz19

Yeah I'd still feel the same way. You don't get rid of centuries of tradition and what your parents and grandparents and great-grandparents did just because the law changes. When I find the woman I love and want to spend the rest of my life with, I want it written in stone that I love her.


PreparationWorried33

You didn’t ask me but I’d say no because in your scenario, would all the other legal benefits disappear like your spouse being able to make your medical decisions instead of family, tax benefits etc? Or would those still exist but just alimony and the like are what disappear?


herefortheparty01

I’ll never get married again


CimZim

What if she wants to wait a bit longer, say two months or so? Or maybe a little earlier...it's not the number of days on a calendar, it's the number of dates and how much time we get to spend together. More time together = comfortable quicker. Like if I were to only go on one date every 2 weeks with a guy due to our schedules conflicting, then in 2 months that's just 4 dates. Not nearly enough time to get to know them for sex. But if we live close to each other and our schedules mesh, maybe we could do 2 dates every week. At the end of 2 months that's 16 dates and I'd very hopefully be open to having sex with him at that point since we'd know each other pretty well. Why do people talk about the span of time rather than number of dates?


herefortheparty01

I personally wouldn’t have an issue. Especially if I was falling for her or if she was genuine. I’ve waited longer before. All I was saying was most of the time the woman I meet wont date. Hell, last night a girl wanted to come home. One date. She got mad when I said no.


CimZim

That sucks, and I'm sorry she treated you like that. It certainly wasn't something worth getting mad about. I haven't had to date in over a decade, I've had a great FWB instead, but back in my late teens and early 20s I literally could not find one guy who was okay with waiting even 4 dates, much less a month or two. I was a virgin until nearly 24 because of this. Few young men want a completely inexperienced peer. It would have been very nice to meet a man like you back then.


herefortheparty01

That’s sorta what I’m about right now. I don’t want to date or something too serious. I’m in my 30’s and have been though some toxic women. 24??!! Wow. I’m impressed. Yeah. Seems to be about right. I know I’m odd. I wait three dates usually. Throws most women off.


CimZim

Hopefully you weren't hurt by them, either physically or emotionally. I wouldn't be impressed...it was extremely frustrating, sexually. I have a high libido and really, really wanted to have sex earlier than that. I'd have been much happier if I'd been able to share my virginity at 17 or 18. How often do you meet women who need more dates than that to be comfortable having sex?


herefortheparty01

Took me a while to move on. But past is past. It’s very rare. I don’t do online. I’ve got no issue meeting irl. But if I don’t put out when she wants, she usually moves on. Women don’t really like being told no in my experience.


CimZim

>But if I don’t put out when she wants, she usually moves on. Women don’t really like being told no in my experience. I getcha. I've had the same experience with men. They all just move on. Guess it just means that patience is a virtue not many people have anymore, regardless of their sex.


revente

Most women probably will tell you they’re gonna wait happily, but reality is that most of the time a guy who cannot seal the deal is just dumped for someone more exciting.


[deleted]

I definitely doubt the majority would. Seems like you gotta move fast for "sparks" whatever joke that is. The irony is the guy looking for just sex fast usually just doesnt give two shits about the girl and comes on strong, and to be honest a lot of women fall for love bombing.


Prismatic_Symphony

This happened with me some years back. I was still technically a virgin and when my gf (who had a count of only one at the time) found out, she explicitly said that she wouldn't have gotten with me if she had known. (Not that I had hidden it, it just hadn't come up in conversation) And I wanted to wait for marriage, but she didn't, and was majorly frustrated. I think it's part of why she eventually broke up with me. I was eventually having sex with a later gf, but we were long-distance and I noticed that I was handling the times between better and with more patience than her. I guess I keep running into high sex drive women or something.


Robotic_space_camel

With the focus word being “most”, I would say yea, probably. Assuming by “waiting” you mean abstaining from sex past the point where she would otherwise want it, then I think it’s reasonable to say that most women would be willing to at least wait some non-zero amount of time. Your experience might be shaped because those women actually were just looking for a hook up and had no interest in a relationship with you. If they’re there strictly for sex, and your putting obstacles in the way of offering it when they have more immediate options, then yea it makes sense that you would have encountered that situation multiple times.


CyberPanda_8822

I’m 27F and still a virgin because all the guys I meet want to have sex right away, while I want to wait. Not until marriage or anything but just to get to know them better. So yes, if the guy wanted to wait for a while before having sex, I would be perfectly okay with that.


sunshinecoverage

My boyfriend wanted to “wait until it felt right” I was so thrown off by that didnt know how to react I mean made me feel like he was so different from other man lol. Anyways was well plaid set a nice boundary for us, made me want it even more and after we finally slept together it felt meaningful. I became obsessed with him !


idrinkapplejuice42

Gives me hope


[deleted]

I believe the thrust of the question here is that the guy wants to wait longer than the girl wants to wait, and women are far too fragile and ego driven to accept such (for sure men are also ego driven but women are by and large the ones complaining about muh sex-drivenness)


NewWayNow

> **thrust** of the question I see what you did there. Good one.


[deleted]

Giggity


CimZim

Lol 😆


idrinkapplejuice42

100%. I think most women are fairly inflexible unless shes super invested.


CimZim

While I agree that women are not all that flexible when it comes to wanting sex immediately/not wanting sex immediately, it's worth remembering that at minimum those two camps exist. It's a matter of finding a woman who wants to wait and not wasting your time on one who will get a bruised ego because you're not fucking her on date 2.


flapperfemmefatale

The only thing I wouldn't agree to is waiting until marriage.


OneDumbPony

Agreed. I waited for my partner to be ready but I wouldn't wait till marriage to see if we're sexually compatible.


-Giga-

Of course I'd wait. It's not hard. Those women who went off fucking other dudes were not a match. Surely, you see that?


CatoftheBanals

If a woman wants to wait for an emotional connection before sex she is not going to be banging other guys casually.


drew8311

I think most guys on this sub don't think that's true. She needs an emotional connection for LTR but still has physical needs while waiting for that to come along.


orangecloverbud

its called a vibrator, about 90% more effective at making women come, compared to lackluster men that need a trial run and need a guidebook on how to make them come and will most likely end in failure.


CatoftheBanals

If waiting till marriage? Yeah, that’s a big ask. If waiting like 3 weeks? C’mon. People can exert some self-control for 3 weeks.


KirthWGersen

I've been the guy she is banging while she makes potential marriage prospects wait for sex, so I know this often isn't true. I've even known women who get those men to drop them off at my house so they can have sex with me; or the guy takes her out for a meal and then she comes to my house after for sex. In her mind it makes perfect sense: I won't marry her, so she has to play games with other guys to get them to marry her.


CatoftheBanals

I can see some women doing that. I just meant if a woman herself wants an emotional connection before sex, she will wait. I had too much anxiety to have casual sex, so I didn’t take any of those opportunities. It wasn’t about marriage or commitment or manipulation or anything, just feeling comfortable enough with someone to do it. I don’t think people should have sex until they’re ready (otherwise it’ll be subpar and then what’s the point?). That said, “ready” was 2 or 3 dates/interactions, whereas I have no idea how long OP means. OP’s best approach would be honesty with the woman so she doesn’t think he’s not interested in her. It’s possible the women he’s after are more interested in LTRs and will be willing to invest more time in waiting.


TheBookOfSeil

If they want to have sex, then it's basically the inverse of the opposite situation: they either won't stay or will have sex on the side while they wait. Women with little to no sex drive won't mind waiting though.


baresquad

You’re basically asking would women that likely wants to wait for sex would stay with a guy who also wants to wait for sex Of course they would, that’s what’s compatibility means. That doesn’t mean every single woman is gonna stay but there’s a bunch looking for the same thing that would


GoWest7

If he's a happy celibate guy trying to be responsible, awesome. I would respect him.


cozy_dozy

I've ditched a guy once for wanting to wait, because at the time all I wanted a hookup and so our goals obv didn't mesh. Funny enough, was asked on a date by my current bf a week later and we waited about 2 months before having sex. So, my answer to OPs question would be "it depends" lol


ohheyhi99

Lmao this comment is a teachable moment Edit: It’s a reminder that many women will break their ~~rules~~ standards for the ones they actually like. Same goes for most men.


cozy_dozy

Break rules? My "rule" is not date people I'm incompatible with, date people with whom I am. This should be common sense lmao.


ohheyhi99

Waiting made you incompatible with the first guy, but not your bf, because you actually liked him Maybe “standards” would be a better word than “rules”


cozy_dozy

How simple minded and incorrect. The first guy I met was about to graduate grad school and start job hunting. I didn't want to go into a relationship with a 99% chance of long distance. The second guy was in the same place in academics and life as me at the time. I knew there was a high chance of us working out (and we are!) Hence my answer to this question, it depends lol.


ohheyhi99

Ok. I was wrong about your situation, but I would have included that extra information for OP’s sake lol. If you leave out that the first guy was moving away, it sounds like you made the decision based on how you felt about the men themselves, not their location.


cozy_dozy

How you feel about the men should also factor in, no? There can be incompatibilities besides location. It could have been political belief, temperament, career, etc.


flowerwoven

A guy who doesn't want to wait is not worth it.


Teflon08191

I think the scenario assumes she's ready but he's making her wait. I suspect it wouldn't go over well.


flowerwoven

Being ready and waiting are not exclusive.


Teflon08191

Didn't say they were.


NoMarriageNoKids

OP doesn't even state what he's waiting for. Get to know her? Marriage? There's a whole wide range of in-between there.


Chaos_and_Horny

is invariable the fact that the woman is having sex with another person?


kissmetilyouredrunk

Nah. Don’t project male sexuality onto women


Chaos_and_Horny

thats good, at least


ScarAdvanced9562

yes, women never have sex with people.


[deleted]

I believe the thrust (giggity) of the question is that the guy wants to wait longer than you want to wait


flowerwoven

I don't see why a guy would wait longer than after the honeymoon, which is when I'd start getting really impatient about no sex. I'd stay with my husband though.


[deleted]

The marital honeymoon? Just isn't the time we live in


flowerwoven

Yeah waiting for marriage is normal but you usually do it right away after the wedding. I'd be ok with waiting a little bit more to let the specialness of the wedding sink in more, and then let the honeymoon be a fun thing on its own, and then have sex as another fun thing on its own after that. Savoring each one. But waiting longer than that would not make me happy.


NewWayNow

And also, the year is 1814.


Nyanu

He's waiting while you're fucking the friend with benefits. lol


Laytheblameonluck

But a guy that makes you wait for sex is not worth it either.


flowerwoven

Why not?


Laytheblameonluck

Because that's what women do. He's classed as "bad at sex" and this justifies all kinds of female behaviour.


Initial_Chemical7121

How does that correlate at all?


WheelIntelligent1354

I'd say it's fair but only if you are like that in general. I'm okay with waiting a little but I would never wait for a woman who wouldn't wait for other men, just for me. It would be my fault, but it feels unfair.


Jayfar14

Most women would just call you a faggot and ghost you


nemporisso

That sounds like women who weren't into you. All that happens with sex is you stay around a little longer because the sex is good. You wait for someone that truly captures your intrigue. At least, I would


ohheyhi99

Maybe but she’ll probably be fucking other guys in the meantime


JacobMoogberg69

You have to understand that the whole idea of women making men wait is nothing more but social conditioning. It works on two ways. On one hand a woman is told her entire life not to give her pussy away for "free" because that's the most valuable thing she owns. She is told men must prove themselves before she gives her pussy away. Men also buy into this paradigm, because they believe if a woman gave him her pussy without making him wait or pay for it (through courtship, dating, dinners, etc.), then she must be doing this with everyone and is therefore a dirty slut. So they never call her again. This leads to women being extremely over cautious because they don't want to feel used. But then a badboy comes along and he makes her feel sexy and turned on and he brings the naughty girl inside of her and she sleeps with him right away, because a guy like this doesn't count. He is not boyfriend material anyway, so it wouldn't make a difference if she made him wait or not.


ohheyhi99

How does this answer his question about the *guy* making the *woman* wait?


JacobMoogberg69

What I am saying is that if a woman needs to get done, she needs to get done and if it is not you it will be some other guy.


ohheyhi99

I agree with that


introversed

Depends on how long he wants to wait


DarkPho3nix40

I mean all of my girlfriends didn’t give a fuck


champagneandcode

F here. I'd happily wait, but IDK if I could wait longer than a few months. In my experience, the longer you wait (within reason) the more build up there is so the better the sex is. Lots of variables at play, but assuming you've met someone there's chemistry with, you're compatible etc etc.


PQie

the issue with the "waiting" problem is that people always assume that it has no effect on attraction. Like "if she likes you, she'll wait" (or same with reverse genders) This implies that the "liking" is build very early and then does not depend on sex. What if sex compatibility is required to truly fall for someone? If someone wants to wait, I will probably think we are not on the same page and do not have the same views on sex, even if I kinda liked the girl in the first place


wtknight

>Ive had experiences with women where I am more inclined to get to know them before being physically intimate and before I know it theyre off fucking another dude. These women weren't worth it from the beginning, so a guy who didn't commit long-term to them is doing himself a favor. I think plenty of women would stay with a guy and be willing to wait, and plenty of women wouldn't. Women aren't monolithic in their thinking about this.


vanillapopsicle

Yeah I’ve known multiple girls who would literally lose respect for you if you did not try to bang them immediately.


idrinkapplejuice42

Lol


vanillapopsicle

It’s pretty sad dude. Think about what effect that has on men. Then women wonder why there’s so many men out there who will try to smash immediately. It’s called conditioning.


John_Oakman

It's part of the courtship procedure: the man/male is supposed to show initiative (making a try) but also show self restraint & delay gratification (getting shot down and waiting). These two traits in the proper mixture is a good indication for success as far as economically/financially goes.


xQueen-Bx

absolutely not, this would repulse me and make me feel unattractive


geometersbane

How are you the only one who isn’t completely delusional


xQueen-Bx

wisdom of age


LovesGettingRandomPm

I don't think anyone asked but I'd like to know your opinion on measuring self worth based on another persons desire to have sex with you, don't you think you're being too hard on yourself?


xQueen-Bx

ones sexual desirability can only be measured by other people's desire for you. this is not self "worth", it is specifically sexual attractiveness to OTHERS. I dont know how I'm being "hard on myself", nothing remotely like that has ever happened to me


LovesGettingRandomPm

You're being a lil' dishonest here, you can't reframe the whole of "this would repulse me and make me feel unattractive" as "sexual desirability to OTHERS". Notice the use of ME in your original statements.


xQueen-Bx

i am not being disingenuous, you dont understand what english words mean


[deleted]

I would. But I personally want a partner who does not have sex outside of marriage.


UrFoodMolestedMyNose

If a guy makes me wait, his dick game better be on point!!!


throwwie234

Of course, I would. But since I'm not the type of women any man wants, my opinion is irrelevant.


BlKaiser

What type are you? I'm having a hard time thinking of any type of woman who would have zero options with men. Unless it's something extreme, i.e you are a convicted murderer or unless you are simply not heterosexual. Edit: clarification in options needed.


throwwie234

I'm not hot.


ohheyhi99

No men have wanted you, including men you didn’t want? I mean, if you’re not interested in a guy then you don’t have to be


Orange_Paisley

It would depend on the guy, how I felt about him, how I believed he felt about me, and how long a wait we’re talking. A few weeks, a month? Fine. A year? Nope.


idrinkapplejuice42

What if you have guy #2 that you also like that wants to fuck asap though? I wouldnt expect a woman to wait any crazy amount of time. But I want to feel like I know her before fucking her. In my experience though another guy has made his move on a girl when Im still trying to get to know her.


Orange_Paisley

I guess I would have to weigh my feelings about the two and decide whether I like the waiting guy or the ASAP guy best. Truthfully I would respect the waiting guy better and think long term prospects would be better. ASAP guy I would suspect was looking for a pump and dump. But since I don’t have two actual men to compare this is all academic and it could go either way.


Laytheblameonluck

Ha ha it depends on how you feel about the guy...if you want to have sex with him or is he useful for something else like domestic work.


Orange_Paisley

Do you often imagine these scenarios for people you don’t know and haven’t met? I dated my first husband a month before we had sex and he was terrible at domestic work.


Hard_Thruster

They're off messing with another dude because YOU weren't worth it. You interpreted your history as a result of women lying about their intentions but there is another interpretation, you were not worth their time homeboy.


idrinkapplejuice42

Eh... I know the difference between somebody I have no shot with and somebody I do. Absolutely there are women that I have been interested in that werent interested in me and so they just fucked around. But ive also had specific cases of women i know I have a shot with and another guy just makes his move first.


nemma88

I don't know about most women. I have been fine. My previous partner wanted a slow build up. Sure it sucks for the gratification you want NOW but I cared about their comfort. I think waiting is a bit of a undefined term, like for some that means waiting a few weeks, some means waiting a few months or some until marriage.


Flightlessbirbz

A lot would, depending on how long they wanted to wait. My only issue with it would be that most men who want to wait are wanting to wait till marriage for religious reasons, and we wouldn’t be compatible there. But a guy who is down to wait till we decide to be exclusive? Hell yes.


Greedy_Principle_342

Yes, I’d wait.


rainbowsuperstar

Sure I would, I mean maybe not something like a year but like a month or more isn't a bad thing. Why would it be? Gives me more time to flush out his secrets :P


Playful_Art_5364

If you promise them a relationship yeah they’ll wait. Men will to. That’s what’s been the norm in all of human history. Not much has changed today if the rewards the same. Men on here say they won’t. But if she’s pretty enough they will


KirthWGersen

You could be the most beautiful woman in the world and I wouldn't wait. The only think that would make me wait is a gradual, but persistent, escalation of physical, emotional and mental intimacy. The reason is that I then know the sex will be amazing when it happens. I will, of course, be having sex with other women in the meantime.


LovesGettingRandomPm

If you have a gradual buildup and a promise of having your desires fulfilled, wouldn't you consider it weak to still have sex with other people. Imagine you're a child making a christmas list of toys they want, knowing that your family will buy you toys from the list but then being so impatient that you buy your own toys before christmas arrives.


KirthWGersen

No. Because I place no value on monogamy. It sometimes happens, but it is never my aim or default. My love, attraction for affection for one person does not detract from my love, attraction or affection for another. Just like my love for my daughter does not diminish my love for my son. I understand and appreciate that most people probably don't feel this way, though, and that is fine.


LovesGettingRandomPm

I don't agree, when you have one person working really hard for your affection, and then you go spend time with someone undeserving just because you want intimacy or sex right now, it's not respectful, you should be able to return the same kind of energy in the form of loyalty or otherwise. Because you know you wouldn't like it if you were in their shoes.


KirthWGersen

No, no. I have no problem with the women I'm seeing sleeping with other men. To me it makes no difference to the relationship we have. You are projecting how you feel onto me. Having said that, I think your way of thinking is perfectly valid.


LovesGettingRandomPm

I'm imagining how the other person would feel, and if they don't have the same openness they could get hurt, do you do open relationships or do you later get to a point where you do care about sleeping with other people?


KirthWGersen

I usually do open relationships (that's the default for me; assumed unless otherwise stated). But I have been monogamous on two occasions


Stunning-Spirit5275

I think if you’re not a particularly attractive guy, a woman will agree to wait for only a short time to evaluate her options. If you’re HVM level, she will wait longer because it’s worth the trade off to get a top tier guy (long term investment)


Laytheblameonluck

No. In this situation women tell their friends that he is bad at sex.


quiturbitchn

I think a reasonable wait of a few weeks is best for all sides. I’ve been both with men who wanted to jump right in and ones who wanted to wait. They both had pros and cons, but I can’t really say I have a preference. I do however prefer exclusivity if having sex with a man.


IcarusKiki

I would be confused why bc either hes religious, has hang ups about sex or is just low libido or not sexually compatible with me. Also depends on how long: up to a month is fine, but waiting much more than that is gonna mean we arent meant for each other.


idrinkapplejuice42

What if he just wants to get to onow you as a person and have an emotional connection before having sex?


IcarusKiki

thats why I said waiting month is fine - but I think sexual compatibility is important too


xcheshirecatxx

I don't wait and I don't date those who wait either. There's no one worth waiting when I didn't even tested sexual compatibility


dbz19

Yes. I dare say many women actually demand this. My first gf was like this.


ohdiddly

Big no from me. I’m a very sexual person so I wouldn’t want to wait and have no reason to make someone wait.


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ChromaticVengeance

Depends how much.


sweetestpineapple

Nope. I would assume he wasn’t attracted to me or had a low sex drive, both of which would make us incompatible. I have an extremely high sex drive and would want the guy to want to make a move and try to seduce me on the first date. Most of my relationships start with fucking on the first or second date even though I go into it expecting nothing.


M_LaSalle

No. If he doesn't want sex then he doesn't want her. Women want to be wanted.


Lyvicious

I'm willing to get to know a guy a bit before getting in bed, but I can't imagine a guy wanting to wait long enough that *I*'d notice and get impatient. That'd be a long while and I'd suspect low T or having a lot or sex elsewhere.


Assasinized

I personally prefer it to be that way, I certainly would.


MelisandreStokes

Fine with me. Only issue is I might think he’s not interested if he doesn’t explain why/how long he wants to wait.


pubgmisc

if its is genuine desire, no


PreparationWorried33

Yeah I would respect his wishes and wait. I think it’s just a matter of what people are looking for. A lot of women that just want casual sex don’t come straight out and say it. They just get things going with a guy and steer things in that direction or hope he steers things in that direction. Which is probably why some of the women you encountered just went off and slept with other men.


learn2earn89

I would be ok with it.


dingdongitslong

I waited and prefer a woman to wait, if she putsnout on the first date she is not dating material to me.