T O P
aliceswndrland

How the hell you gonna to tell me i can't eat in my own damn house?


HabibiJayParker

That’s what my partner said lol


Slider78

I don’t see a problem with the no eating rule. I also don’t see a problem with you deciding to not participate because of it if you want to. I’d don’t think they treated you like a child. You overstepped a boundary that was set so they controlled it. Seems like a logical chain of events to me.


Criminalia

I agree. Like, why not eat before or after group? Its not that long. And if I were in a group therapy session, sharing my reflections and pain, while looking at someone casually snacking away....I would feel that person was being rude.


craneboii

People can't always control when their blood sugar drops. If I saw someone eating in their own house on a zoom call, it's not my business. I feel like as a human being, able to share pain, have experiences outside of others, and one who has health issues, I should expect that of other people as well. Food is also a very calming thing when it comes to anxiety. It tricks the anxious brain into believing its safe ("why would I stop to eat if I'm in danger?"). If someone is anxious being in a group where they share pain, then who am I to tell them their way of destressing is wrong? Especially in a DBT group. Plus, from the sound of it, OP seemed to be taking notes and learning concepts, compared to sharing some struggles, etc. My group therapy was an hour long, and right after school/work when I was in it. I didn't always have time to go grab something, as well. If I had the luxury to be on zoom (this was back in 2018-19, before covid) I would've eaten in my own house and no one would've stopped me. They didn't care if we needed a snack either; it was a lax rule. More of "don't bring a meal."


TemporaryArtichoke39

>”why would I stop to eat if I’m in danger?” you just blew my mind. i now know why i’m always rummaging for food when i’m anxious


TheDuhllin

I think you may not be considering the people that get triggered when they see someone else eating food. Yes, you might be fine seeing others eat. But some don’t. Going into a support group like that should be a safe place. It’s the last place you should feel triggered in.


craneboii

People are on zoom, it really can't be that noticeable unless you're going out of your way to watch them. ED or not, you shouldn't tell people what they can and can't do in their own home. Bro was eating cause their blood sugar dropped; that makes it hard to focus, feel sick, and just overall uncomfortable. Maybe I'm not considering the other people getting triggered because blood sugar dropping can be a more dangerous and pressing concern. So what if it isn't in this situation; it could be in another. I don't get triggered when I see people eat, but I used to have a binge disorder. Food either made me hungry or really uncomfortable. But I *never* told anyone they couldn't eat around me. I really don't like the idea that anyone thinks they have the right to control someone else's body because they can not take care of their own. Regardless, people need to see that there are things they can not control. When I was in DBT, we learned many coping skills to help us when something happened out of our hands. There are things bigger than ourselves; it's not a comparing trauma kinda deal, it's recognizing that you are the only one in the room with potential health issues.


TheDuhllin

There definitely are people that can notice someone eating without going out of their way to watch them. Think about the movement from hand to mouth. It’s not exactly subtle all the time on things like zoom. I’m not saying a rule like that should be in place but it also needs to be taken into consideration that this could trigger someone. Not to mention, couldn’t OP have drank orange juice or something else? I’ve also read that pepperonis is something to avoid in OP’s situation (correct me if I’m wrong, seriously). You not getting triggered when you see people eat doesn’t exactly matter though, because it’s you. That would be like thinking everyone has the same exact symptoms for a disorder, and same experiences/reactions. Yes, DBT is for coping skills, and groups like this help with coping skills, but not everyone can learn coping skills as soon as they get in the group. It takes time. The group should be a safe space for everyone. Best thing is for OP to go to another group or set up some kind of compromise. There’s no reason to continue eating in the group if OP can drink something to get their blood sugar up. We need to take into consideration what OP is going through, and we need to take into consideration someone possibly being triggered in regards to food. We can’t just ignore the part about triggers and focus only on OP. If we’re doing that, then the best thing (IMO) to do is to leave the group and find another.


craneboii

I agree with the last paragraph wholeheartedly and hope op takes into consideration. I won't lie, I struggle with empathy so it is hard to think outside of myself sometimes. Sorry for the lack of insight and thankya for the thorough reply.


TheDuhllin

No need to apologize, all is okay. If you believe you lack empathy (I’ll believe you on that, not saying you’re lying, I’m just saying that it didn’t cross my mind that you might), but can admit to when you’re showing signs of it, that’s a great thing, and I can tell from that, that you’re on a good path. But yes, the best thing is to try and compromise with the group, or find another one. If the rule is there simply for control, then OP could (and should, IMO) definitely take more action with trying to change that rule. There’s no reason to have a rule in a group if it’s meant to control the members.


Blue-popsicle

It's never bothered me because on my zoom, I only see the person speaking. Or I could choose to see a few people on the panel at the top, which is easy to move through if you don't want to see a particular person. Of course I would never eat when I'm speaking or when we're in Brady Bunch formation. No biggie. I'm sure my group leader would tell us or myself after class if it were a problem. She keeps it light though.


stinky_kitties

my mom has diabetes, when your blood sugar drops you don’t have time to wait. you have to eat pretty quickly or it gets really bad really fast :/


Slider78

I missed where op said she was a type 1 diabetic.


TheDuhllin

Maybe OP updated but I’m definitely seeing OP say they have blood sugar issues.


stinky_kitties

they didn’t, but they have blood sugar issues and it’s probably something similar if not diabetes. for both situations, if you blood sugar drops you need to eat pretty quickly before you start experiencing migraines, nausea, fainting, etc. it’s pretty serious either way


mmmdinoadhdlove

they weren't "snacking away", it wasn't a time that people were talking about pain and reflections it was catch up on notes


Chaostii

When your blood sugar crashes you need to eat IMMEDIATELY. You can literally die from lack of sugars to your brain. You don't even have to be that low to start having seizures or losing consciousness.


Perfect-Editor-5008

Yeah.... That's not actually true. Please make sure when speaking so definitively about medical facts that you have them correct. Can it have an immediate impact on you yes, can you die from it? Not really unless you're a type 1 diabetic. My father was type 1 insulin dependent. I've seen it personally many times what can happen to a person like that however the normal person will only experience the following: As hypoglycemia worsens, signs and symptoms can include: Confusion, unusual behavior or both, such as the inability to complete routine tasks. Loss of coordination. Slurred speech. ... Symptoms Looking pale. Shakiness. Sweating. Headache. Hunger or nausea. An irregular or fast heartbeat. Fatigue. Irritability or anxiety.


Slider78

That’s not true.


itsuki-shu

you didnt even read the post 💀 they had to eat because they were getting SICK


Slider78

I did read the post. She could have had some orange juice or something with sugar in it to drink. Or stepped away from the camera for a second to cram some pepperonis in her mouth. Rules are just a fact of life. Follow them or don’t but understand that then you accept the consequences if you decide not to.


Individual_Peach_578

Some rules are dumb and are meant to be broken


madampisces

low blood sugar is not a medical issue and she was eating food that doesn’t even help with that issue she’s just lying so she could do whatever she wants


localnarcissist

Honestly, though it sounds ridiculous, it's also entirely possible that someone else in that group isn't comfortable seeing others eat. For example, some people with eating disorders feel weird about food. Might be somewhat of a stretch, but it's entirely possible that there's a reason why you weren't allowed to eat?


tiffanyblueskin

OP did sign the group policy agreeing not to eat during the session. then proceeds to break it and gets mad.


ColorfulPlants

Blood sugar issues won’t wait for you to be “able” to eat. If they can’t accommodate OP literally just eating some damn fucking food that is inhumane and could potentially be dangerous. I’ve almost passed out from my blood sugar issues. OP, you did nothing wrong and that rule is ridiculous. Edit: if food or eating are triggering to other group members, they should allow OP to turn their camera off and mute their mic for the couple minutes it takes to have a snack


wandringstar

You could lean to the side and take a bite off-camera, or perhaps use liquids instead. One always has to be prepared for an emergency, but if you know the rules then you should be able to schedule your routine within reason. If the administrators know that there is a blood sugar issue, they can make accommodations. I said this in another comment but rules like this usually exist because someone fucked it up for everyone and it’s gone south before


Blue-popsicle

>Comment That's what I do. I never had to sign something for it though. I never really considered it triggering anyone, I just thought it was rude. Glad to be reminded. It's only when I'm super tired and need to munch on something for a bit to stay awake or if getting a migraine


HabibiJayParker

That makes no sense to me thought because you’re allowed to drink. I think it’s a control thing.


localnarcissist

Drinking is different from food. I can't really see it being a control thing because moderators really have no business or genuine reason to do that, but you know your situation better than I do. You might just be right.


IronDaddy69

Well drinking can also be a trigger for a lot of people with eating disorders. So if they really were concerned about eating disorders, they shouldnt let people drink either.


localnarcissist

That's true, I'm not really sure honestly. It made sense for me for eating to be a sensitive subject but not drinking, but it's really stupid that a group for adults would have a rule like this without really having a reason for it?


TheDuhllin

Possibly because no one in that group has any disorder related to drinking. Or at least not that they reported. As for food, someone could have said that they’d prefer not seeing someone eating because it’s a trigger for them.


Ludens0

I have never been allowed to eat in any kind of classroom. It is disrespectful.


Callsign_Starmaker

what the hell kind of classrooms have you been in??🤣i got whole pizzas up in those rooms


Ludens0

In university??? Hahaha


Callsign_Starmaker

nah my college classes let me eat all the time lol


Ludens0

I guess is something cultural then. What about high school?


Callsign_Starmaker

lots in high school as well. i remember people would come in with fast food meals on their desks


keathofthestars

My teachers used to hold buffet days and bring ice cream cake in high school so idk I guess it depends on the teacher


Ludens0

Where are you from guys? Genuinely curious


keathofthestars

Im from the US, Midwest specifically


Slider78

So what if it is a control thing? You still agreed to it. They don’t have to explain their motivation behind a rule. They state the policy and you decide if you’re willing to participate within that framework. Life is very unfair. You have to make a certain peace with that fact or you’ll be miserable more than you have to be.


TheDuhllin

They did agree to it but the rule being there for control is not great either way. You shouldn’t put a rule down for control, you should put a rule down because there’s an actual, good reason for the rule to be there. “Control” is not a good reason.


tryinghard2live

Yep! I hate being treated like shit too. My dbt group and one on one therapy are both zoom, it's just shitty to be treated like that online.


HabibiJayParker

Well it’s like if I was eating a 4 course meal, I’d get it. It was legit a few pieces of pepperoni and a small cheese stick. I don’t even want to go back. I’m so frustrated.


justjboy

Wow. I feel like as you aren’t eating a massive distracting thing or making a noise (so just being muted), I don’t see why snacking in your own home is an issue. I get why they might not want eating/drinking in a venue. Also, I would have communicated that you needed to snack for the reason why you needed to eat (which you might have done) so.. for health reasons, I don’t understand the insensitivity.


HabibiJayParker

I updated with the email.


graveyardgirlxo1

Happy cake day


justjboy

Thank you! 😊


girlsledisko

Tbh so many pwBPD have eating disorders I’m really not surprised there’s a no eating rule. It can just cause distress where it’s not necessary. I get it though. However, I would have turned off my camera if I needed to eat something.


mmmdinoadhdlove

they weren't allowed to turn their cameras off that's against the rules too. plus OP mentioned that you could hardly even tell they were eating


WillowWispWhipped

We’d always just message the group leader and say something like, hey, I’m eating so I’m going to have my camera and video off but I’m listening. We were supposed to wait until break time but sometimes that’s just the way it was and they were cool about it.


Zenla

Unrelated note...if your blood sugar is low why are you eating a food that doesn't contain carbohydrates?


madampisces

because she’s lying about blood sugar dropping


Zenla

Yeah "blood sugar issues" is not a medical condition. If she did have a condition that causes low blood sugar she would not be eating pepperoni to treat a low. In fact high fat foods in particular are one of the worst things you can eat during an episode of low blood sugar.


Slider78

Exactly she was hangry not on the verge of death. I hope she continues with the dbt. It sounds like she could really use it.


mmmdinoadhdlove

shut up. just shut up. "sounds like she could really use it". A) you don't know they're a girl B) it is not your business to determine who 'really needs' DBT from a rant. it is a rant, they're venting because they are upset. invalidating their emotions and feelings due to this event which you have limited knowledge of does nothing good. C) shut up


Slider78

Shut up? Sounds like you need some dbt too.


mmmdinoadhdlove

ahh yes because telling someone to shut up definitely means they need DBT


tortoistor

a small child would have been allowed to eat if some adult brought them to a meeting where the rules don't allow it. you were treated like an adult who means it when they promise something. (why didn't you turn your camera off yourself before you started to eat?) i understand you feel upset. still, rules are rules and being expected to follow them is only reasonable. (also, psst - i am one of those horrible eating disordered people who appreciates rules like this. yes, drinks are different)


itsuki-shu

its a dumbass rule 1. they were getting sick 2. it's their own house lmao how are you gonna stop them from eating?


tortoistor

turn the camera off then? it's not that hard


itsuki-shu

then theyd have a problem that theyre "not paying attention" or disrespectful 🙄 always gotta be an issue. cant they just eat ffs? they said it was barely noticeable


tortoistor

from what i can understand, there was no rule against turning off your camera. there was, however, a rule that explicitly forbids eating on camera. an adult would be expected to respect it, don't you think?


HabibiJayParker

We can’t turn our camera off.


madampisces

but you will do it anyway? also pay attention when you lie about having low blood sugar, you’re not eating the food that helps with this (non medical) issue.


mmmdinoadhdlove

who are you to tell them they're lying? do you know them? do you know what type of blood sugar disorder they have? maybe that food was the only thing they had in reach? they weren't allowed to leave, they weren't allowed to turn their camera off.


madampisces

I already explained.


Visual_Hippo4979

I would please encourage you just to seek to move past this in a constructive way. You haven't committed a crime nor done anything wrong but in all honesty neither did the facilitators in switching off the video. Rules like this for group therapy are there for a reason. We can get triggered by the smallest of things. I once had a meltdown because someone checked their watch 2 times during a session and I read too much into it. I held so much weight against something that to be honest was just nothing. Sometimes it's just an unfortunate situation and no one is really to blame or needs to be blamed. Don't set fire to everything in a rage response as there could seriously still be some healing to be had here, just focus on getting the most learning from this DBT available. Sending healing vibes to you


[deleted]

[удалено]


HabibiJayParker

You do know where you are, right?


wandringstar

Sounds like someone in the group has food issues. Rules usually exist because someone fucked it up for everyone so they’ve probably seen this go south before. I’m not saying your feelings aren’t justified because you may have had other negative experiences with them that color your opinion. I myself don’t have an ED so I can’t say if drinking water triggers ED but I highly doubt it is the same thing because you need to drink 3-4 liters a day to be healthy, water fountains everywhere in public, etc. Not drinking water even for a short period of time can pose a health risk especially for people on certain medications, so just like not letting you take a bathroom break it wouldn’t be beneficial to ban drinking fluids, but everyone can plan ahead and make sure they don’t have to eat during this short specific time. Eating during the session may also signal to others in your group that you don’t take their time and testimony seriously, which can be seriously upsetting as BPD folks are extremely rejection-sensitive.


gr33n_bliss

The emails seem pretty reasonable. They probably forgot ti turn the camera back on, or might have expected you ti message to say you were done eating. There should have been clearer communication from them though. Hope you feel better soon


HabibiJayParker

I get that but they had messages completely disabled.


gr33n_bliss

Damn that’s annoying. Hope you can resolve things with them.


Deviousaegis47

Ugh. I'm so sorry.There are some seriously shit DBT administrators out there. I hate hearing this b/c DBT itself works. But the number of terrible programs and practicioners is disgusting.


HabibiJayParker

I updated with the email.


Subject-Lecture-9367

Idk why modern mental healthcare literally created itself to push away people easily pushed away and likely to walk away. I’m so sorry you are being failed by others, but don’t fail yourself mate. You are you’re best friend and you are on the right path. Don’t let the apathy of clinical treatment dissuade you from pursuing this massively important work you are doing to heal AND improve. Proud of you man. And proud that you decided to discuss this rather than let it fester into a resentment


aShyVixen

I get how someone talked about eating disorder so if the group wasn't long id just snack and turn my cam off until I was done eating and if they asked why I turned it off I'd be honest. Because I do understand how someone eating during someone's emotional story or if they had eating disorder it could cause them hurt so idk perhaps that's why there Is a rule like that :o but at the same time I totally get where ur coming from especially cause I have gastro problems and my stomach will hurt horribly sometimes if I don't get food in while I have pain :( cause eating soothes it. Their email seems a little rude to me but if you go back I hope it works better for you I thought of trying one of these groups soon but I hate super strict meetings so hmm


Littlelisapizza83

I don’t think the no eating rule has no to do with eating disorders necessarily. I think it’s more to do with the idea of mindfulness and eliminating distraction so that group members can focus entirely on the task at hand. I think I’ve seen this mentioned in Marsha Linnehan’s DBT manual.


girlsledisko

This is something I hadn’t considered, but yes I think you’re absolutely right.


CaregiverOk3902

think it's because a significant part of dbt is focused on participating in the moment so if you're eating in group it's kinda like multitasking which is something that dbt encourages us not to do.


mmmdinoadhdlove

OP mentioned in update that they're one of the only people who participates and it was catch up on notes time


feelsblind1312

That’s so weird… In my DBT group (in person) biscuits are literally offered in a basket on the table and when a member of the group graduated the program two weeks ago they literally had a charcuterie board. The only time I’ve personally found an issue w food during group was when some girl was chewing REALLY loudly next to me lol.


nicktheturtle

it's very likely that you were censored to consider someone's eating disorder, which is important 'cuz group therapy is meant to be a safe space without triggering distractions, but if that was the case I feel like *some* kind of explanation should've been offered in the email.


paintingsandfriends

I know this isn’t the point of this post but I’m an online teacher and not allowed to eat or drink during my classes. I just move my head outside of camera range for a quick second as if I’m grabbing a pen and take a quick bite there.


toon9

I tend to just turn my camera off for a minute, pretend it’s the door or something.. Then have a quick vape 😆 or eat something in your case.. Camera back on and no one the wiser..


BloomingAngel

OP you simply need to eat while you’re on break. You could’ve snacked while catching up on your notes, or better yet you could’ve eaten before session. I’ve never heard of anyone eating during therapy. You say don’t want to be treated like a child, but you’re throwing a temper tantrum as if you are one. You broke the rules when you had other opportunities to snack, and then you thought you were above the consequences. I am glad you decided to continue DBT.


HabibiJayParker

Nah I left because it wasn’t worth it lol


Warm_Opportunity5902

[Stop Dialectical Behavioral Therapy (DBT) Facebook Group ](https://www.facebook.com/groups/340175527923912/?ref=share)


PrincessMalyssa

What's DBT?


SYNTHLORD

D - Dining B - But T - Threatening


PrincessMalyssa

Dangerous Bat Theater


PreservativeAloe

Dialectical Behavioral Therapy:)!


rainbowlavalamp

In my group we were allowed to drink but not eat while it was on Zoom (and obv not drugs or alcohol). People vaped all the time though so obviously there wasn't much they could really do. Some people used to smoke cigs during group if they happened to be sitting outside. TBH I feel as long as ppl are being respectful (e.g. not eating chips with the mic on) then group should just be a safe space and you should do what you need to be comfortable


TheDuhllin

Genuine question, but, aren’t you supposed to avoid pepperonis if you have blood sugar issues? From what I’m finding, that’s one of the top things to avoid.


typicalmethead

I Couldn’t do that I hate being controlled in any way tell them to f off


No-no-dog

personally, dbt had useful skills to learn, BUT they’re also skills I can google…..


Visual_Hippo4979

Well this is extremely useful to know... thank you. When I used Google to find out about DBT I learned there might be many other benefits to being supported and guided by a professional either in group or individual therapy too.


Whoactuallyknows19

My DBT Therapist LITERALLY studied with Marsha Linehan in the early 90s and we constantly were snacking and taking drinks (non-alcoholic of course). Also, for what it’s worth, my therapist told me that empathy is one of the key components that make DBT so beneficial for pwBPD that other forms of therapy seemed to miss out on. <- she made this discovery before DBT was a thing. She asked a psych hospital for their “worst of the worst” patients and most of them were emotionally dysregulated and suicidal. She did sessions with them and after a while, many of them stopped returning. When she went to them and asked why, it was because they had felt judged, misunderstood, invalidated (etc.) Seems like your group leaders may need to work on their empathy skills. You cannot help it if you have a blood sugar issue and if they aren’t willing to work with you….they aren’t very empathetic/caring and you should find a new group.


Visual_Hippo4979

I think this will NOT help OP! I also think you have misunderstood the facts here in THIS situation. According to their response email to OP they have recognised OP's efforts in trying to manage the situation. No one is to blame in this case and it is possible for this situation to be constructively resolved without making anyone the villain (including the group facilitators). If anything I would be encouraging OP to use this experience to reflect and learn to be mindful. To reinforce an incorrect negative narrative that the group leaders were not empathetic is just wrong. I'm sure you mean well but OP needs support through this issue not to be told to run away from it.


Whoactuallyknows19

I must not have seen all the facts. If they corrected themselves and acknowledged their error, then OP should continue with group but if they are not, then I stand by what I said. 👍🏽 If OP has a genuine medical condition and needs food, there’s no reason for the leads to have opposition to it, especially if OP is trying to be respectful about it. Thanks for sharing your opinion though.


Visual_Hippo4979

I agree with you in that IF they are indeed being unsupportive then OP should seek alternative therapists / support. I was just highlighting it really doesn't read that way to me. It is very common for us to cut and run when we feel unsupported and that is ok, it's a defence mechanism but can also be an overreaction due to the nature of the condition (in simple terms I am pretty sure this is the issue with OP!). In terms of GROUP therapy some rules are there to protect everyone and if OP indeed suffers from severe low blood sugar ie Diabetes or something, then that could have been addressed before and additional arrangements/ allowances could have been made. I don't think this was the case. I'm not sure why my previous comment was downvoted as I was just trying to express that a situation sometimes doesn't need to be framed in terms of a win/lose scenario. I respect your perspective and thanks for your reply too.


Whoactuallyknows19

I agree!! :) Sorry, I’m not the best at elaborating/expanding on my statements online sometimes. Too many words getting jumbled up in my head and I lose track of what I’m trying to say. Haha but yes, I agree with what you’re saying!


mmmdinoadhdlove

that is so messed up. you're in your own house, you're allowed to eat. you had your audio off so it wasn't distracting. i would definitely email the people who lead it and express this because it is not fair. you are not a child and shouldn't be treated like one


HabibiJayParker

I updated with the email.


mmmdinoadhdlove

you phrased it amazingly. you were firm and showed you were frustrated with their actions that were so shitty but remained polite so big well done to you. can't lie their response is so shit. for me, it came across as they were congratulating themselves for their skills being used by you? they should've at least apologised for their actions and asked what they can do in future. they're not showing any signs of apology


HabibiJayParker

Thank you. I really tried to not come off as explosive. I am very upset they dismissed me.


mmmdinoadhdlove

absolutely!! like you sent them a well worded email explaining what happened and your emotions and they barely put in half of the effort you did for their response!!


Melthiela

Wait why can you not eat? We have group therapy live and they offer coffee, cookies and snacks every session for free... What kind of asshole shit is this?


HabibiJayParker

Exactly. I emailed them but their response really upset me.


RimWorldIsDope

To me, it looks like they legitimately commended your use of de-escalation skills. Im just a stranger online, but I think you might still be in the anger fog on this one.


Melthiela

You got completely dismissed?! Yeah I think it's time to swap therapy, I hope there is something else available for you...


RimWorldIsDope

They didn't dismiss them at all though... They commended them on using their de-escalation skills


mmmdinoadhdlove

OP wrote a long fantastically worded email and they responded with two sentences. Not acknowledging OP's feelings at all, kinda just congratulating themselves on OP using DBT skills in my opinion. They didn't explain why they turned off the camera or say what can be done in the future